Temple Mills Help

[rockinjohn]

Hi Stu, in the mid '50s their were Three(3) goods that left Feltham for Temple Mills @8.54am/7.57pm&12.20am returning @ 12.5pm(1.35pmSat)/10.55pm &4.00am engine &crews were S.R &usually a Q1,Standard 4MT 2-6-0's 76030-4 were allocated new to (30A)to cover the Temple Mills /Acton workings sometimes turning up on the Hertford East passenger workings.one other working of note was a Temple Mills/Hither Grn that travelled via the T&H/Willesden& West London lines(the long way round) hauled by a massive J20 class,I had often seen J17's working thru on S.R. yard bound goods@ Clapham Junc.I assume starting @ Temple Mills, destination most prob.Norwood Junc. or Hither Green.jj

[Mickey]

We had a 'Whitemoor goods' departing Welwyn Garden City during the weekday evenings back in 1973 worked by a blue livered class 31 and probably a Hitchin train crew and it was a pretty long train of mixed wagons from WGC Up yard.

Regarding Temple Mills we had a Temple Mills to Welwyn Garden City the 'Shredded Wheat train' that ran as 8B07 worked by a blue livered class 31 hauling a rake of short wheel base grain wagons and a brake van. This train I presume ran during the 1960s and was still running during the early 1970s during the weekday early mornings arriving a WGC sometime before 06:00hrs and was then crossed over into the Up yard.

[rockinjohn]

Hi Mickey &all, their was a reglular 7pm (ish)northbound goods from WGC yard every weeknight, that had an ex KX Shed engine supplied running up light to work it forward,worked by a V2/A3 or the odd B16(50A) which maybe a clue to its destination,by the motive power supplied most have been a heavy/long train & possibly fitted.jj

[Mickey]

jj you should have been a loco shed foreman or controller because you are well versed in train movements back then. ha ha ha...

[03piggs]

Hi all.

Thanks so much for all the help on this.

These sheets have been completed so I'm hoping that I will post it up on here sometime in the next few weeks, work allowing.

Stu

[Mickey]

The rather limited and little known and used passenger service that use to run through Temple Mills use to be a funny service. Formed by a x2 car Cravens unit it use to work 'The Tottenham Hale shuttle service' between Stratford high level station & Tottenham Hale through Temple Mills on the passenger lines/through lines and back stopping at the only intermediate station at Lea Bridge station and passing through Temple Mills East junction & Temple Mills West junction then Copper Mill junction and Tottenham south junction on route. This service ran I presume through the 1970s until 1984-85. I remember seeing it during 1979.

[manna]

G'Day Gents

Worked the 'Shredded Wheat train' many many times, used to leave Temple Mills around 3 am, it was a Heavy train, often 600 tons, and usually un-braked, many times (in winter) you would slip to a standstill at 'Western sidings' Finsbury Park hand sanding was common, you would normally be 'put out' on the mainline at the North end of Finsbury Pk. You would just about reach 30mph by Hatfield, where you would have to start braking, you would leave the train in the Up goods yard, the engine would be attached to a set of suburban coach at around 4.30am for steam heat duties, booked to leave WGC around 7.30 am.

manna

[Mickey]

G'Day Gents

Worked the 'Shredded Wheat train' many many times, used to leave Temple Mills around 3 am, it was a Heavy train, often 600 tons,

That particular train was involved in a crash at Hatfield in March 1968 see- the link- https://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/docum ... ld1968.pdf

I remember this crash was featured in the local Welwyn & Hatfield newspaper at the time which also included a photograph of the damaged loco a Brush type 2 after hitting the brick wall killing the driver & secondman.

Also the two signalmen who receive namechecks in the official report namely P.J.Cleverley at Hatfield No.3 and Dave Vince at Hatfield No.2 I both kind of knew of slightly. P.J.Cleverley was a Hitchin relief signalman who I met by chance one afternoon back in August 1970 when visiting Woolmer Green box and running an errand for him and Dave Vince was still at Hatfield No.2 when I was a telegraph lad at WGC box between 1972-74. From memory Dave on closure of Hatfield No.2 in April 1974 may have gone to Hornsey Up Goods for a couple of years before it finally closed in 1976 and P.J.Cleverley possibly died sometime during the 1980s someone on the forum once claimed?.

[rockinjohn]

Hi just for the "T" &"i"crossers, I had the # correct for the Fowler 2-6-4 tank(42328) '55 thru '57 on the GN,but its derailment into the sand drag was @ Woolmer Green on the Up Slow on the 07/10/56, but wait their's more just like the steak knives on the TV adverts,@around the same time 42374 after (34D) went to(34B) for a very short spell, failing &returning to Neasden, with the better of the two "28' actually working an UP "CBE" &staying longer on the GN, maybe this working was a (34D) standby for a failure.jj

[rockinjohn]

Hi Mickey saw that train a few times in steam days usually an N7, couple of coaches, always wanted to catch it for the trip past the neck of (30A)&the Temple Mills yards,but the timetable was strange the train never seemed to came back in a resonable return time frame almost like a "Parley" train,think I might have seen a Met.Cam.two car on it once E790XX&E792XX in a very light green livery.jj

[jwealleans]

its derailment into the sand drag was @ Woolmer Green on the Up Slow on the 07/10/56

Funnily enough, our colleague in Australia who's modelling Woolmer Green posted a picture of what I assume is that derailment last week:

[StevieG]

its derailment into the sand drag was @ Woolmer Green on the Up Slow on the 07/10/56

Funnily enough, our colleague in Australia who's modelling Woolmer Green posted a picture of what I assume is that derailment last week:

Fowler_tank_42328_derailed_woolmer_green_up_07-10-56.jpeg

Thanks v.m. jwealleans and 'colleague in Australia'.

I knew Woolmer Green box a bit, around 1969/'70.
The track leading to the derailed loco has a new/temporary look about it to me : Perhaps laid as an extension to help with the retrieval.

[rockinjohn]

Hi all the Fowler tank was retrieved on the morning of Sun 07/10/56 not sure if this was the day of the mishap,by "thunderbird" B1 61105 paired with a replacment tender from an A2/1 @ the time, a very good photo was published in BRI Vol2 no5 of the incident taken by J.F.Aylard a regular G.N.section photographer/railfan in the '50's.jj

[Mickey]

Meanwhile back in the Stratford/Temple Mills area...

Probably most people didn't realise because most people never went around that part of Stratford but during the 1970s it use to STINK pretty badly around the Stratford FLT and High Meads & Lea Junction area. Apparently a 'soap factory' was located along the river Lea that caused the stink?. I think that area has been redeveloped since the closure of Stratford loco 20+ years ago along with Stratford freightliner depot for residential housing.

[65447]

The soap smell, which was not 'stinky' but quite strong, nay pungent, when the wind was in the right direction, emanated from the Sunlight soap factory that produced laundry soap and was sited near the junction at Bethnal Green where the Cambridge, Enfield and Hertford lines branched off the main line. Also by the junction was the Bryant and May match factory. The former soap factory has been converted into housing.

Back on topic, I have a copy of the 17 June to 15 September 1957 Freight WTT, Section O (London, Hertford East, Bishop's Stortford and Branches) if of any use? I would need to scan it (over 100 pages)...