Extra long CCT & other parcels stock

[manna]

G'Day Gents

I'm in the throws of finishing a Parkside Dundus extra long CCT, it says in the instructions, that there livery is 'painted teak' is this imitation teak, coach teak or just a browny colour, I've seen the Hornby ones on E-Bay and there an orangy/mustard colour, Thanks in advance.

manna

[jwealleans]

There's a good colour picture on Paul Bartlett's site. When it's finished undergoing maintenance, I'll post a link.

[2512silverfox]

It is the same 'ersatz teak' colour as used on coach underframes etc.,

Precision do it in their range. In LNER livery the ends were also brown.

[manna]

G'Day Gents

Thank you for your advice, Hmmm, might be a bit of a hard one, Precision paints are non existent in Oz and Humbrol railway paints are rare, standard colours are available, might have do a bit of experimentation with paint colours. Got to go down to Adelaide in three weeks, I'll have a look in a model railway shop then.

manna

[ArthurK]

"Teak" brown varied considerably especially with weathering. Precision Paints teak is a very light colour when compared with a vehicle weathered with dirt and age. individual interpretation also enters the equation. As an example I offer the following photograph of a preserved example. This was taken at the Monkwearmouth museum in the mid 70s.

ArthurK

[manna]

G'Day Gents

Thank you Arthur, a very nice picture on two counts, one for the colour, quite brown isn't it, and two, nice to know one has been preserved, Thanks again

manna

PS, while we are on the subject of parcels stock, are the any more kits available (besides the pigeon van) I believe the LNER had a lot of different types of vans.

[ArthurK]

Not sure if he has any still available but Roger Chivers did several NER/LNER parcel/ CCT vehicles including NER 4W CCT, NER bogie CCT and the LNER version of the latter. He also did the LNER 45' (?) bogie CCT.

All painted with Precision Paints Teak but toned down on the latter two.

Arthur

[manna]

G'Day Gents

I like them Arthur, I'll have to see if I can find any of those, Thank you.

manna

[jwealleans]

The bogie ones are still available from Five 79 models (Roger's son). 2750 had one from him recently. The 4 wheel one I suspect is an Ebay search.

Roger also does the 4 wheel PBV, often called the pigeon brake, which you mentioned.



Dan Pinnock's lists, usually mentioned on here are your best source for parcels vehicles. Bill Bedford does some as well: I've not yet completed this GNR 6 wheeler:



This ex-GN Milk Van is also from Bill's etches:



as is this ex-GE vestibuled passenger brake van.



It's worth looking through his website and 'to order' list. You have to remember that they don't generally include castings, although this delightful GER Milk van did:



I haven't built any of his, but Andy Edgson of isinglass offers this GC CCT:



.. and this GE area 4 wheel van:



(Both the above from D & S kits). The GC CCT is also available through the Great Central Society, although I'm not sure about the supply situation.

If you fancy something quirky but not LNER, I fairly recently found that David Geen still does this Midland 4 wheel CCT and for far less than they fetch on Ebay:



Getting back to where we started, the photo Arthur has posted from Monkwearmouth is the same vehicle Paul Bartlett had photographed. I usually refer back to it as a reference point as it was restored in the 1970s, when there were a number of people still alive who had seen the livery in LNER days.

[D2100]

I am moved to comment that that GN milk van is particularly gorgeous. Almost enough to tempt a bloke out of the diesel era

[Bill Bedford]

T
Bill Bedford does some as well: I've not yet completed this GNR 6 wheeler:
This ex-GN Milk Van is also from Bill's etches:
It's worth looking through his website and 'to order' list. You have to remember that they don't generally include castings, although this delightful GER Milk van did:

I'm working towards up grading most of the kits it that list. The four and six wheelers are to have the present etched underframes, but will be given new casting and if possibly a roof moulding. For the bogie stock there will be a one piece underframe, bogies and a roof mouldings. So far the underframes I have ready are the GC 50', GN 58', GN/LNER 51' turnbuckle and one of the NER 52's. Others are being work on. I planning to make the underframes and bogies available separately.

[2512silverfox]

Actually the Monkwearmouth vehicle was painted in a slightly darker hue of Precision 'Teak'. At the behest of the NRM, I raised the specification for the refurbishment and arranged the paint with the then owner of Precision. Certainly LNER teak did vary considerably prior to 1939 when externally manufactured gloss paint was prescribed and my copy of the original GA drawings for the CCT bear a note initialled by HNG to the effect that the gloss pain is (was) to be used in future.

Prior to that time, each works mixed a quantity of the colour at a time (usually in a galvanised dustbin) from which painted replenished their kettles. This provided a mat coat which was then varnished. The actual colour varied throughout the working week even if stirred etc.

[drmditch]

The subject of the teak-brown colours comes up from time to time. I did a little bit of research (and experimenting) for my ex-NER clerestory (of which there are more to make) a few months ago. Mr Harris mentions BS490, but that seems too dark for me. Obviously 1930/40s paints would not necessarily have had the consistency across batches that we might expect today, and as Mr Tatlow points out, practices between works and shifts and individual painters would vary.

For what it's worth, (and depending on the precise settings of computer monitors etc) here is BS490 :-

On RGB scaling this comes out as 91 52 33

However, to me, (and based on visual impressions from published photographs and the examples of CCTs on the NYMR) this looks better:-

LNER Brown Experiment 151 80 33.jpg (3.67 KiB) Viewed 11503 times

This is RGB 151 80 33

The latter is what I try to emulate, before of course the simulated layers of coal smoke, brake dust, and general weathering. I run very few vehicles straight out of the paint shop!

[jwealleans]

Code: Select all

Almost enough to tempt a bloke out of the diesel era

Listen to the voices, Ian, listen to the voices.....you know it makes sense.

[JASd17]

I think we have a problem here.

It depends exactly which stock you are referring to and exactly when and exactly which works was responsible for the maintenance. All tricky problems given the lack of colour source material and, the poor quality of many official negs of coaching stock. And on the latter point I have seen first hand many hundreds.

It you are thinking of the mid 1930s or earlier period NER passenger coaching stock, this was NOT generally just painted, but given a finish similar to the dynamometer car.

CCTs and horse boxes are different, as are many GE Area examples of all passenger stock.

John