Nu-Cast P2 - Rebuild using RTR Components

[marksouthcoast]

I hope you have a lot of fun building her, could you please let us know how got on getting the buffers.

[S.A.C. Martin]

Thanks St Johnstoun, useful to have the comparison of the two chimneys.

I should be getting the P2 at the end of this week, along with two other restoration jobbies which I am looking forward to. They are part of a group of five engines I earmarked from a job lot sale on this forum earlier in the year, being bought to fill in gaps in the stocklist and also to allow me to change tack a little bit by building up existing models to better standards, rather than outright build or have built for me.

Either way I am looking forward to this build. I've always wanted a P2 and I don't mind doing a bit of work to get a half decent model of one. Okay, wartime black isn't the livery most people will go for, but in my view that gives me a bit of carte blanche to do some weathering on a P2.

[S.A.C. Martin]

Lone Wolf: The rebuilding of a Gresley Nu-Cast P2: Part 1

So it begins!

[Blink Bonny]

Cor.

Tony's started summat here!

[S.A.C. Martin]

I'm rather hoping to come home to find the P2 amongst other future projects sitting in a box at home this evening. I already have most of the key components to replace, so we'll see how it all goes together I suspect.

I'm most excited about this project as I feel it's an opportunity to indulge my passion for the express locomotives of the LNER further as well as perhaps convince myself that whilst never a perfect, nor a talented modeller, I am a modeller and will continue to enjoy what I do.

I've also had an idea for the replacement driving wheels, which may prove rather fruitful later on if it works...

[marksouthcoast]

Juest give your best shot and enjoy your self.

[S.A.C. Martin]

Tried dismantling the P2 today. It's been a nightmare! It's built like a proverbial brick out house. I am going to B&Q tomorrow for something stronger than the B&Q brand paint stripper...

The driving wheels are Nu-Cast I think - white metal with a steel (?) rim - and I have an identical set of (flanged) driving wheels left over from my defunct A2/1 kit which was used for spares some time back. The flangeless centre driving wheels can be replaced by A2/2 drivers. The problem is, I appear to need a specific screwdriver to remove the drivers...? What kind of screwdriver should I be looking for?

The valve gear and cylinder combination, along with the motor and gearbox, are all horrendous. In fact I think it's not unfair to say it needs complete dismantling and rebuilding from the ground up, with a new motor and gearbox combination.

There's potential in the model to be more than the sum of its new parts. A little experimentation with another model has shown the cartazzi standard to Hornby A3s and A4s can be cut and shut easily to provide correct a length fixed cartazzi for the P2.

Lastly, did some research. I am now very puzzled. Yeadon states the extended streamlined fairings at the front, and over the water filler cap, were removed in 1938. This means wartime black and the streamlined fairings (as on the tender supplied with my example) is wrong. This also means, logically, that a standard A4 tender in all over black should be suitable for the P2 in wartime black, no?

[Manxman1831]

Tried dismantling the P2 today. It's been a nightmare! It's built like a proverbial brick out house. I am going to B&Q tomorrow for something stronger than the B&Q brand paint stripper...

The driving wheels are Nu-Cast I think - white metal with a steel (?) rim - and I have an identical set of (flanged) driving wheels left over from my defunct A2/1 kit which was used for spares some time back. The flangeless centre driving wheels can be replaced by A2/2 drivers. The problem is, I appear to need a specific screwdriver to remove the drivers...? What kind of screwdriver should I be looking for?

The valve gear and cylinder combination, along with the motor and gearbox, are all horrendous. In fact I think it's not unfair to say it needs complete dismantling and rebuilding from the ground up, with a new motor and gearbox combination.

There's potential in the model to be more than the sum of its new parts. A little experimentation with another model has shown the cartazzi standard to Hornby A3s and A4s can be cut and shut easily to provide correct a length fixed cartazzi for the P2.

Lastly, did some research. I am now very puzzled. Yeadon states the extended streamlined fairings at the front, and over the water filler cap, were removed in 1938. This means wartime black and the streamlined fairings (as on the tender supplied with my example) is wrong. This also means, logically, that a standard A4 tender in all over black should be suitable for the P2 in wartime black, no?

Sounds like your P2 has the old style Romford wheels - you'll need a split-driver (screwdriver with a hole running up the middle of the blade to go over the extended axles that are used in outside-framed locos), also known as a Romford driver.

I've looked at the drawings available on the web, and according to them the wheelbase between rear driving axle and the Cartazzi should be the same as on an A1/3/4, or 9'6".

Sounds like you got a solid piece of kit, whichever way you look at it?

[mick b]

Markits do a screwdriver. If you want to save some money get a cheap/old narrow Screwdriver and file a slot in the end to fit the nut.
I cant think of any reason why a standard Tender would not be suitable for the P2.


Good luck !!

[Atlantic 3279]

As the decision to cut back the original extensive top fairings on the A4 tenders was implemented around 1938, following a fatality caused (I believe) by the "blast" of water directed into the cab by the fairings when filling a tender from troughs at speed, and the bonus effect of cutting back the fairings was that coaling up of the tenders became easier and capacity slightly greater, then it would seem reasonable to assume that all streamlined tenders got the same treatment.

[marksouthcoast]

I belive you are correct and this incident was one of the reasons for the a2/3 getting flat fronted cabs and the glass in spectical plates was changed to armoured glass. And a good read about operating the pacifics on the east coast main line can be had in pn townsends east coast pacifics at work and he covers the p1 and the p2 as well.

[S.A.C. Martin]

Thanks for the confirmations on the tender lads. Livery is up in the air again, but I'll explain later.

Pics coming up shortly, but the Wolf is now in lots of very shiny silvery bits, after an afternoon in nitromors - hooray! The model can definitely be turned into something good but I am now considering my options RE the chassis. Grateful to see the Hornby cab will fit!

[Saint Johnstoun]

Mark, you are not correct in assuming that the vee fronted cabs disappeared because of the Wiske Moor incident. It was the right side cab window that was smashed. The return to flat cabs was a Thompson fetish as part of his anathema to certain things Gresley. When Peppercorn took over there was a return to vee fronted cabs but with the top cut back so that the safety valves were covered by part of the boiler cladding.

Although the incident mentioned above had something to do with cutting the fairings back, there were other complaints regarding access to the tenders, plus reduced coal capacity compared with the original format as built in 1928 and this also had a bearing.

[S.A.C. Martin]

The return to flat cabs was a Thompson fetish as part of his anathema to certain things Gresley.

That is surely just a bit of anti-Thompson propaganda. The flat fronted cab looked more like a return to "Gresley" styling on a non streamlined Pacific than the V fronted cab on the A2/2s!

I can't help but feel that point is severely flawed. I do agree with your other point though; the change to the flat fronted cab and back was more about styling than practicality.

I was going to have pictures but the camera is refusing to play ball. First time for everything! The cab is definitely going to fit - huzzah! I am looking at the front end and a plan is forming. I may be able to incorporate some of the Hornby A4 front end, purely to replace the front doors.

Chimney conversion going well too. Much better than I expected. Having worked out why exactly the P2 and A4 chimneys are different, I did some cutting and shutting and the overall effect is closer to the real thing than the Nu Cast one.

The chassis is giving me a bit of a worry in terms of work - most likely need to source cylinders and valve gear as the Nu Cast set aren't up to scratch.

[marksouthcoast]

Pherhaps comet v2 valve gear or one of morgens etches for the a2/3 with hornby tornado cylinders ?.