Atlantic's works: Portable layout - Scenic details next

[Dave]

Graeme how did you form the corners? and how did you manage the second one? I was intrigued as the width is not great.

[Atlantic 3279]

That's where reality and "what if" divide. Perhaps any further wagons that might actually have been built under the scheme that was to include the Baldwin loco(s) may have been to similar pattern but without any doors at all, creating a stronger wagon suited to discharge by a new dockside side tippler.
I'll be building models of those wagons that did actually exist. In that form they will be of more use to me and possibly to others.

Going back to material for the sloping parts of the side cantilevers, I see that Finney and Smith list some 1.5 x 1.5mm T section brass. I'm not sure of whether this is in reality a different and slightly finer product than the more widely listed 1/16" (1.6mm). I suppose that in either case, a light even rub over with a file on both sides would soon reduce 1.5 or 1.6mm width to the dead-on dimension of 1.33mm if I/we choose to be pedantic......

[Atlantic 3279]

Sorry, the reply above should refer to the earlier point about the purpose of these wagons.

Dave: further apologies, I missed your question when I looked earlier. The answer is that I formed to bends with much difficulty, patience, adjustment and swearing by gradually pushing them over using two different sizes of vice for different stages of the operation, plus bars where required to support the material that was sticking out of the vice. It didn't go well at the first few attempts of course, the bends not forming as smoothly as I wanted nor in quite the right positions, and I couldn't form the second bend until I'd partly eased-back the first one as it was totally in-the-way!
Life would have been much easier had I possessed something more in the way of tools, such as a hold-and-fold clamp plus a rigid plate with something like a 2mm radius rounded edge, as I'm sure that in conjunction witha bench vice these would have made it (relatively speaking) a doddle. I suppose that bending the sheet over a solid solid steel former of the right width (or or using a male and female die pair plus a hydraulic press) would of been ideal, but mine is the world of kitchen-table modelling.

[Dave]

Graeme.
No need to apologise.

I had an idea it would be a bit of a pain, thanks for the description.

[Manxman1831]

Bill, I stand corrected. I seemed to remember from earlier post about them being designed for traffic that was not there - shipping huge quantities of coal from Manvers Main to Immingham Dock, using the Baldwin as motive power.

Graeme, from your research into the monster, were the driving wheels of the Baldwin of a similar size to an O4? I suppose if a class of them had been built up they may have ended up on the London coal trains (allowing for things like curves into the yards at Marylebone and Rickmansworth)?

[Robpulham]

Sorry, the reply above should refer to the earlier point about the purpose of these wagons.

Dave: further apologies, I missed your question when I looked earlier. The answer is that I formed to bends with much difficulty, patience, adjustment and swearing by gradually pushing them over using two different sizes of vice for different stages of the operation, plus bars where required to support the material that was sticking out of the vice. It didn't go well at the first few attempts of course, the bends not forming as smoothly as I wanted nor in quite the right positions, and I couldn't form the second bend until I'd partly eased-back the first one as it was totally in-the-way!
Life would have been much easier had I possessed something more in the way of tools, such as a hold-and-fold clamp plus a rigid plate with something like a 2mm radius rounded edge, as I'm sure that in conjunction witha bench vice these would have made it (relatively speaking) a doddle. I suppose that bending the sheet over a solid solid steel former of the right width (or or using a male and female die pair plus a hydraulic press) would of been ideal, but mine is the world of kitchen-table modelling.

Hi Graeme, that does look rather nice and neat for something that you describe as a kitchen table method of modelling method of doing it, my hat goes off to you.

Metalsmith now do a bending tool which is essentially a hefty steel pate with lots of threaded bars and a selection of round bars of various thickness's that either clamp down or have holes drilled in the ends for cap screws (Allen screws) I seem to recall it was about £60 +p&p when I got it last year - I can take some photos of it to better explain if they would be of use to anyone?

[Atlantic 3279]

I'm hopelessly mean when it comes to spending money on tools - far more eager to "make do" with what I have and channel the money into the railway models themselves.

I only tried to bend up the wagon sides and floor all in one piece as I thought that would save another chore - of heavily scribing the outlines of more separate pieces into the 15 thou brass sheet until they eventually became willing to snap free without distorting. I think I may well have been wrong. Two "half bodies" bent into simple L shapes then soldered together using an underfloor central strip would have been easier to shape as desired.

[earlswood nob]

Hi all Gresley fans
I am attempting to convert a D49 into a C9 and whilst it looks easy, it certainly isn't.
When I make a little more progress I will post some pics.
The boiler needs lengthening, which was relatively easy.
The chassis has to be made from scratch, again relatively easy.
Next came the bogies and problems. I tried making double framed bogies, but that didn't work. Then I tried making outside framed bogies, which are slightly better, and will do till I get a different idea.
Coupling rods relatively easy from Gibson Universal rods
Connecting rods are a problem, and I made a pair yesterday from Nickel silver strip, with brass wire soldered to the strip and filed down for the fluting.
Tender is a old Wills GS4200 with the underframe removed.
Good luck to anyone attempting the conversion. They will probably make a better job than me as I am a lousy engineer.
Earlswood Nob ( A signalbox near where I grew Up)

[Robpulham]

I'm hopelessly mean when it comes to spending money on tools

I know where you are coming from Graham. I have to admit to being a bit of a tool junkie in the past but since converting the garage I haven't the room for them so sold a lot. Now I only buy things that I feel I will get a lot of use from. With metal kits being my modelling medium of choice then I am happy to buy things like rolling bars, rivet presses etc.

[Atlantic 3279]

I've made some progress with that bogie wagon now, although much remains to be done. The exterior is clad with 10 thou plastikard, done in seven separate bands across the width of the body so as to make it possible to create the square-edged door sections at intervals along the rolled edges of the main body. Those squared-off areas have solid in-fill behind them so that they will stand up to further work. Excessive solvent application caused annoying sinking / rippling of the plastic cladding in places, hence the current temporary grey-primer finish applied over various areas of filler as a guide-coat for final rubbing down. The interior of the sides and ends is also clad with thicker plastikard, 30 or 40 thou but scraped and filed to taper to a thinner top edge. The floor has had and extra 2mm of thickness added internally to give it strength and (I hope) stability. Having decided that the model would have to be constructed as a wagon that would always run "full", I've also implemented a safety tip picked up from Phil Atkinson: I recalled that at Doncaster exhibition he had shown me an example of an O gauge resin-cast wagon body with a true empty interior, whose sides had bowed considerably, plus one featuring un-authentic internal bulkheads whose sides remained straight as a die. Those bulkheads will make a handy set of supports for a thin deck dressed with a load of coal.

When this is all rubbed down, there's goodness knows how much rivetted framing, door outlines, central girder spine and headstocks to add before I even think about cantilevers and trussing......

[Manxman1831]

Most impressive

[mick b]

Well done, impressive job.

[40C]

You should give Limonene solvent a try Graeme, it's less aggressive on the plastic.

[Atlantic 3279]

Perhaps you are right and I should try it. How does its lack of aggression influence its ability to create a strong, complete bond though? Does it "flash off" slowly enough to allow its use as I sometimes use Humbrol Liquid Poly, i.e. paint it over the surface to be bonded and allow time for full layer of viscous, sticky, dissolved plastic to form before closing the joint. This technique seems to work well when joining dissimilar materials such as styrene and abraded "insoluble" material, or styrene and a "reluctant" plastic such as a Bachmann loco body. The Bachmann plastic itself often seems to need abrasion followed by two washes of solvent in order to bond well with plastikard.

[52D]

40C above, do you know if Limonene is the same solvent as Lemsolve. Only asking as we were made to use it on nuclear sites and i have a secret stash hidden away.
Lemsolve did react with certain plastics.