Correct name for Detonators

[60800]

I thought the Tynesider was March 10th?

EDIT: Whoops, it's the Lincolnshire poacher on March 3rd

I'll be videoing the Tynesider at Crowle. It's impossible to get a good long shot in Scunthorpe

[StevieG]

Just remembered : 'Shots' is(was) another unofficial name for detonators in general.

As well as those placed by hand, and the 'pairs' just outside signal boxes, operated directly by lever or equivalent, there were also the instances where 'pairs' were also located level with posts of, and operating in unison with, a very few stop signals (although in the late '60s there were around 20 examples in the ECML's London area) whose levers were coloured (top half) red; (bottom half) B & W chevrons pointing up or down according to line direction.
Also there were some ground lever-operated fogsignalmen's det.-placer machines, which were often (always?) of magazine type.

[Mickey]

Deleted

[loco cleaner]

Thanks for all the replies.

[sirbrian]

Detonators were designed to create a loud noise as a warning that could be heard easily by the driver of a steam locomotive in the locomotive cab. In many cases, there was a considerable distance from the first wheel to trigger the detonator at the front of the locomotive to the locomotive cab, so a very loud noise was required in order to be sure that the driver would hear it and take appropriate action.

In more recent times, detonators have been used to remind drivers of the existence of temporary speed restrictions. Some thirty or so years ago I was riding in the cab of a Class 86 electric locomotive on the WCML when the locomotive set off a detonator as a reminder of a coming speed restriction. The noise in the cab, being almost directly over the exploding detonator, was extremely loud. I thought that something terrible had happened to the locomotive. Looking back, I think that this occasion was the only time that I ever heard a detonator activated while riding in the cab of a locomotive or multiple unit train.

Sir Brian

[jukebox]

In a similar vein, I can clearly remember an occasion where I was riding at the front of the lower deck of the front carriage in a double-deck EMU in Sydney one summer, with the windows wide open (no a/c) and the train approached a perway gang, getting off two detonaters. The percussion of that noise, just a few feet away, was incredible.

*snip*
Some thirty or so years ago I was riding in the cab of a Class 86 electric locomotive on the WCML when the locomotive set off a detonator as a reminder of a coming speed restriction. The noise in the cab, being almost directly over the exploding detonator, was extremely loud. I thought that something terrible had happened to the locomotive. Looking back, I think that this occasion was the only time that I ever heard a detonator activated while riding in the cab of a locomotive or multiple unit train.

Sir Brian

[Mickey]

Deleted

[52D]

Looks like OVS Bulleid had a hand in the design Micky.

[Blink Bonny]

Ay up!

Was he on strong medication at the time? If not, should he have been?

[StevieG]

Detonators were designed to create a loud noise as a warning that could be heard easily by the driver of a steam locomotive in the locomotive cab. In many cases, there was a considerable distance from the first wheel to trigger the detonator at the front of the locomotive to the locomotive cab, so a very loud noise was required in order to be sure that the driver would hear it and take appropriate action.

In more recent times, detonators have been used to remind drivers of the existence of temporary speed restrictions. Some thirty or so years ago I was riding in the cab of a Class 86 electric locomotive on the WCML when the locomotive set off a detonator as a reminder of a coming speed restriction. The noise in the cab, being almost directly over the exploding detonator, was extremely loud. I thought that something terrible had happened to the locomotive. Looking back, I think that this occasion was the only time that I ever heard a detonator activated while riding in the cab of a locomotive or multiple unit train.

Sir Brian

With the very slight delay in detonators' explosion sound travelling between its detonation point at rail level and a few feet above that, and the Paxman Valenta engine's noise, the advent of HSTs with their travelling notably faster than any previous normal service train, and the driver's position relative to the leading axle being further forward, I seem to recall that in the late 1970s there was a concern that at top speed, an HST driver might not discernably hear that detonators had just been exploded.

This may be what led to a temporary instruction (well, on the Eastern Region's ECML anyway) that where three detonators twenty yards apart were normally required (e.g. to protect an engineering possession), three pairs of detonators were to be laid.

I don't remember this instruction becoming permanent, so I suppose that that concern was eventually decided to be unfounded.
With later high-speed trains, like Virgin's 220/221 Voyager DMUs and 390 Pendolino electric trains, and presumably the 373 Eurostar, the driver's probably a little more forward of the first axle than in HSTs, though with the 'Pendo' and the 373, at least there's no risk of diesel engine noise in the cabs.

[Mickey]

Deleted

[StevieG]

I recall sometime around 1999/2000 Railtrack as it then was was telling there operating staff that the use of detonators during engineering possessions was going to be abolished but due to a number of concerned complaints from various parties on the job the proposal was abandoned.

In more recent times (in the last 12 months) the same proposal has been brought up again about the abolition of the use of detonators during engineering possessions although at the moment detonators are still being used during engineering possessions.

You're right about that initiative in the Railtrack times Micky.
You probably recall that a brand new T3 Possessions Rule Book section, including 'no dets', was actually circulated, but then it got pulled and a temporary version quickly produced.

Regarding detonators, I reckon H&S concerns about injury from shrapnel was one factor in trying to get rid of them from Possession protection arrangements.

[52A]

When was the last time anyone was hurt by shrapnel?

[StevieG]

When was the last time anyone was hurt by shrapnel?

Ah, yes ...!
Now there's a good question!

[manna]

G'Day Gents

Been into more than one Engineers possession, mostly on cl 31's, you really feel the bang in your feet and backside, even if you never heard the bang you would feel it, luckily never had any go off whilst on the mainline.

manna