Atlantic's works: Portable layout - Scenic details next

[Atlantic 3279]

Thanks Mick, that's a useful reference, but what a performance

I'm pleased to say that save for straightening the free running plate, it "all comes out in the wash" on conversion to A2/3, which is the destiny of this second loco.

[60526]

Very nice work Graeme. What Brunswick paint have you used on the model and who's lining?

[Atlantic 3279]

Erm, have a look again - the Brunswick one is the Bachmann A2, as yet untouched, out of the box.

[60526]

Sorry, my question was ahead of itself. What paint and lining would you use I meant to say.

[Atlantic 3279]

I imagine that Coachman would be horrified by my bodging, penny-pinching, ultra-conservative, patch painting approach to the job, but this is my intended approach......

COLOUR: After mixing BR green to match Bachmann's version on a couple of A1s when I cut those down to make A2s about three years ago, and then to match Hornby's versions on A4s turned into W1s, my staple ingredients for a mxture to match those greens currently include:

Humbrol 195 (sometimes near-enough right for Hornby straight out of the tin)
Railmatch BR loco Green
Railmatch DMU green
Tiny amounts of black to darken shades.

I'll have to initially look at my previously painted test cards against the A2, then decide whether a previously tried mixture is correct or whether a new one is needed. As I'll only be painting green the cab and firebox (or maybe the valances too) on my next loco, then according to how accurate I feel the final match is, I'll either fade-out the paint over a very "soft" feather-edge on the firebox, or take it up to the final lined boiler band which provides a deceptive break.

LINING: As I won't change the dome on the second loco, I'll possibly need to line only the cab. As the width and style of Bachmann's cab / tender panel lining doesn't match the boiler bands anyway, I won't worry too much if the final style isn't an exact match either, BUT, the colour of the orange lining may be a concern. Bachmann's is VERY orange, and I think my usual choice of Modelmaster (now masquerading as Kemco, which it certainly isn't, Kemco was different again....) is less orange, either paler or more like tan. This may be true of HMRS lining too. I had some success as part of the W1 conversions with a bow-pen application of a tinted varnish over cab lining, to make it more red/orange. Alternatively, if the rest of the loco is to be weathered for realism anyway, starting to tone DOWN the rest of the lining before lining the cab could be a viable approach. If you are going to change the dome you have to interfere with at least two boiler bands anyway, more if you go for a diagram 117 boiler look, so you may as well then unify all of the lining on the loco by applying the same transfers to all of the boiler bands as you use on the cab.

Whichever way it is done, I find that with care, and an overall unifying finish of the same varnish, preferably with at least light weathering, the result looks "all of a piece" rather than a collection of oddments.

[60526]

My reason for asking was that I've been told that Precision Brunswick is the best, or from another, Railmatch is best, and HMRS or Modelmaster for lining, I suppose it comes down to what they have got used to. I was also told to consider Fox lining transfers, so I have got somewhat confused. I think in a way I was lucky and got my A2 off of e-bay last week for £80, a private sale that seemed to have been running for less than a day with a buymenow flag and it was gone 23:30, thought it was a bit strange but for a loco that was £112 elsewhere what do you do? Mind you it is in Apple Green so will need a complete repaint and relining. I've got some Precision gloss brunswick which I've used in the past and even after a very good stir I'm not convinced by the finish. A final weathering seems to cover a multitude of sins.
How can Coachman be horrified by your bodging, I'm amazed at some of the coach finishes he produces without the use of Precision or Railmatch. Each to their own.

[Atlantic 3279]

Before I say more about colour matches and lining, here's a picture to justify what I said about the unsatisfactory sag in the long straight section of running plate on the left side of my factory-fresh Bachmann A2 Bachelors Button:

It is of course, ridiculous to try to prove or disprove a colour match using a photograph. Neither the system used to record the image, and the system used to display the image, are likely to have the same relative spectral sensitivities as the human eye, so the "weighting" of the different colours present gets distorted. Add to that the fact that the colour test cards that I previously painted have a nearly matt finish, whilst the Bachmann A2 paintwork is quite a shiny satin, plus the fact that I haven't the time or patience to photograph things from all different angles to eliminated unwanted differences in reflection from the surfaces, and the whole object of a photograph of the process or the result is largely defeated. Nonetheless, here are a couple of quick shots of me trying out test cards against both flat and curved surfaces on the loco. In daylight, after much study from different angles, a 4:1 mixture of Railmatch 300 (Std loco green) and 303 (Later MU green) begins to look favourable. Humbrol 195 in this case is too pale and mossy, even if it appeared a good match to BR green on recent Hornby A4s!

[Atlantic 3279]

And here's the problem, and a possible solution, affecting the applied colour of the Modelmaster BR lining. On the pale blue backing sheet it looks strongly orange, but here on a test chip of green (in this case the Humbrol 195 which looks especially pale and mossy with its dull finish and the unhelpful reflected light in this picture) the TOP RIGHT strip of lining is the raw result, which now looks much too pale/yellowy/tan compared to the strong reddish (or even pinky) orange of the Bachmann lining. On over-coating the lining with some dark red tinted varnish, TOP LEFT and LOWER strips, the lining colour match improves, but it is tricky to make the over-coating of tinted varnish go on smoothly and evenly, without spreading onto the green surround and without raising the ridge of the lining to an unacceptable degree.

[mick b]

Never used the BR version are the HMRS version any good?
Not that impressed with Modelmaster decals in general.

[S.A.C. Martin]

If you want very orangey orange, for the BR lining, Fox Transfers orange/black/orange is very orangey...! As in, it's brighter and closer to the Bachmann shade.

Can't say I've been too impressed with the modelmaster ones either, but their cabside numerals were very useful recently for experimenting with on various paints.

[Atlantic 3279]

I've not used the HMRS version either, so I'm ignorant on the matter of the applied-over-green colour. For lining, rather than numerals and insignia, I quite like waterslide such as Modelmasters because of the freedom to shuffle it into exact position before fixing it down, even when fittings and irregularities are in the way. I'm not sure I can do that successfully with pressfix. My experience of Modelmaster has however shown me inconsistencies of printed line alignment and thickness, and inconsistencies in the bond between the carrier film and the colour layer (sometimes it falls off, especially if it has been trimmed, sometimes, especially if you want it to come off, it sticks like **** to a *******!)

Is the Fox lining REALLY consistent high quality stuff? Given that in this £8.25 pack for instance:

BR British Railways - Express Passenger Steam Locomotive Lining General Pack - Corners & Separate Straights only
Code: FRH4050/3
Scale: 4mm/00

you appear to get a few more corners but definitely far fewer straights than the significantly cheaper Modelmaster 4081, I'd want to know that I was getting my money's worth...

[S.A.C. Martin]

I like it, personally. Lined out my Jubilee, "Trixby" A2 and an A4 Pacific with it. One sheet is enough for one engine, you do get a lot of corners left over.

[60526]

Graeme, a little box arrived on the doorstep yesterday with the resin bits for the conversion. Very good quality, very little flash and I found it easy to clean out the cab windows as you suggested. Pleased with this, just need to get hold of the Isinglass drawing and valve gear now.

Lining - attached are photos of the Fox set for an A4. Not the best of photos, but there seems to be slightly more orange on the boiler bands that the tender, but not as much as you'd see on the Modelmasters or HMRS transfers.

[Atlantic 3279]

Thanks for those comments and images.

Just so as not to mislead others, I should point out that some of 60526's castings were rather more "flash-free" than would be typical, as part of his set was included in the group that I timed myself cleaning up.

[Atlantic 3279]

I've been digressing from the Thompson pacifics them for a moment or two, producing another cobbled together drawing of a fantasy loco to annoy the purists. Now I know there's a thread somewhere on this site for such locos, but I can't find it, so the drawing will have to do just here. I am not, by the way, entertaining any immediate thoughts of building one of these, a pure Gresley / Doncaster 3-cylinder 4-6-0. As to when and why such a design might have appeared, I'm leaving the reasons vague. Maybe it could have appeared around 1920 had the GCR, GNR and GER already been amalgamated (as they had wanted to be) by that stage, assuming Gresley were at the head of the combined CME departments? Maybe some other justification for a pre-B17 medium to high power 4-6-0 unrestricted by penny pinching GER permanent way practices can be imagined? Who knows?
I've had to separate the part of the image showing the tender to preserve reasonable image size and resolution, but anyway, here it is, mainly A1 "engine", O1/O2 boiler, and a K2/K3 style cab: