ROY@34F wrote:John,
I'm sorry to cause trouble for you . I may well be wrong after all . I did ask an old friend , who was a goods guard when I was a fireman in the days of the O2s . But he was'nt sure ,which surprised me . It would certainly be interesting to find out for sure. I must admit when you come up with over a thousand tons up a 1in 100 , it does sound a tall order . Although the O2s were 3 cyl.engines ,maybe powerful enough ,so long as they could keep their feet. I don't recall ever having a problem up Ancaster bank , and as you say we would have a good run at it so long as Honington's distant signal was off, and then go for it !! We'll hopefully get to the bottom of it one day ! I'll try a few more old mates when I come across them.
Roy.
Please dont apologise Roy. I am happy to accept that my memory is playing tricks on me, because it has done on many other occasions. After all, this is around 50 years ago and I was only a schoolboy at that time.
I suppose that because the 1 in 100 only lasted for about 3/4 of a mile it was not that much of a problem, but I remember watching a video of a 9F starting a 1000 ton stone train on the level at a quarry open day, and that seemed to have a bit of difficulty.
Thanks John for all your calculations; you have blinded me with science but I am grateful for the efforts you have gone to.
John (strangsteel),
I would also like to know exactly how many we used to have on,on the iron ore trains in steam days. I did ask a chap I bumped into the other week who was a fireman at the time. I did'nt make any suggestions,just "how many",if he could remember? He came up with 27,after some thought,but again ,was'nt sure. I will keep it in mind,and let you know if I discover any more;but if you look at the very fist photo of John's on this thread of a WD approaching Grantham with a train of loaded tipplers,there is mid to high 20's of wagons on.
Regards,Roy.
Yes, I think you are right Roy. I dont know where my low figure came from.
The sad thing is that very little seems to have been written about the area east of the main line. I have a book on the Honington to Lincoln line, but if there has been one published for the stretch between Honington and Boston I have never seen it mentioned.
I wonder if any of the relevant sectional appendix would have something in?
Sorry to everyone if I have high-jacked this thread and ventured a little O/T.
workev wrote:
In this photograph there is a rack behind the shed which held wooden boards to be inserted into open gangway ends to prevent water getting in during tender filling. Does anybody have a photograph of these racks.
I have several photos of the rack from a distance (there was one at the south end of the Up platform on some photos); but not one close up. In fact does anybody have a photo of the water column, equipment shed and rack at the north end of the Down platform?
I want to model this as a little diorama, but cant find any close-up/detailed shots.
Ian
Sorry, I don't have anything that will help, but here are some published shots; no close-ups, but just in case you've missed them:
Colin Walker's Trails of Steam Vol 6 - images 43 and 46 (both b/w)
W. Elgar Dickinson's Steam - The Mystic Harmony - page 100 (two - both colour)
You'll see that beyond the shed and rack there's another, smaller box against the railings. I've no idea what that was. The railings are still in place, incidentally.
Whilst I have access to a few photos of parcels trains at Grantham, I am not sure of how they worked at the station, or even what trains ran.
Did TPOs ever stop at the station, or even run through it (late 50s/early 60s).
Parcels trains were made up of a real eclectic mixture, so any info or shots of parcels trains or notes from spotting days would be gratefully received.
I believe that the only confirmed working of a Brit at Grantham was 70037 on a Down parcels train, so were there any other unsual workings like this?
I love the family of NER 4-6-0s although the older ones looked more elegant, this one exudes Darlingtons ideas and you can see many classes of loco which have a similar look inspired from the drawing office there.
Hi interested in the area served by 52D. also researching colliery wagonways from same area.
Not sure that I recall seeing any mention before, but did B17 "Footballers" ever venture through Grantham at all?
I assume the B16 was a substitution at York (for a V2 maybe); so maybe a B17 did the same?
It would be interesting to see what unusual workings went through Grantham. For example, did any Bullied Pacifics ever get to Grantham on specials (trials excepted)?
I have asked the question re 8Fs before and recieved a negative response, but never widened the discussion to other types not normally associated with the GNR at Grantham.
I know that this proves nothing, but you can never say never. Although I think it would be a very rare occurrence.
I suppose the only way would be to look through as many magazines as possible from the relevant periods and hope there were enthusiasts present at the time eager enough to send a report to the railway press.
The photo of the B16 is a nice shot. Note that the up line's been relayed with flat bottomed track with baseplates and spikes, but the down line is still bullhead. By the time of our first visit, in August 1961, both main lines were in f/b, although some pointwork had still to be replaced.
On the Britannias, a former Grantham fireman told me that he brought one through from Nottingham once but he doesn't recall its number. This must have been before Sept 1963 because he finished when the shed closed.
Most spiked baseplated track was laid in the period 1955 - 58
Going by the dates I have seen stamped on the baseplates. I have not seen many outside that date range.
The Britannia may have been the return working by 70037 "Hereward The Wake", it was recorded on a parcels service from March to Nottingham (I think the picture is in Colin Walkers book). Again I suspect a substitution for a V2.
If not, then maybe there was a second working!
Many people have thrown away their spotting notes, so RCTS, etc, and magazines are really the only source other than the web!
The Brit here (scroll to the bottom) is said to be on an East Anglia - W Riding parcels which intrigues me as they would normally travel via the GN&GE through Spalding and Lincoln. I wonder if there were diversions taking place for some reason?
(edited to say that maybe this was maybe not such a rare occurrence after all)
I had an hour to spare this morning, so dug out some magazines from 1957 (these were the first ones I came across in the cardboard boxes where they reside).
TI = Trains Illustrated, RO = Railway Observer and RM = Railway Magazine.
The following are some noteable workings through Grantham that I picked out, although a few assumptions have been made that the loco worked the entire service.
Dec 14th 1956 61461 noted at Wood Green on up parcels TI 2/57
Dec 15th 1956 60519 on Clarence Yard-Hull freight through Grantham TI 2/57
Dec 27th 1956 60101 passed Grantham on relief to up Northumbrian TI 2/57
Jan 17th 1957 61580 ran l/e Grantham to Lincoln for a test on turntable TI 6/57
May 17th 1957 48534 at Boston with iron ore train for Frodingham
May 20th 1957 48445 ditto
May 22nd 1957 48493 ditto TI 7/57
These three instances of 8Fs do not prove conclusively that they passed Grantham, even though one edition of Trains Illustrated mentions High Dyke, the previous month suggests the may have originated on the GN&LNW then ran via Bottesford S and E Juncs and Barkston E.
Jun 1st 1957 76100 2.25a.m. Doncaster to Grantham class H freight and spent the weekend on Grantham shed RO 7/57
Jun 6th 1957 62543 seen at Newark on 3.45a.m. New England-Doncaster class H freight RO 7/57
A D16 on this working must be like hens teeth.
Jun 27th 1957 64960 4.50p.m. New England-Doncaster coal empties (not sure if this ran via ECML) RO 8/57
Jun 7th 1957 61434 8.20p.m. KX-Dringhouses xp freight RO 7/57
July 26th 1957 61463 heading north from London on fitted freight TI 9/57
Aug 24th 1957 73168 arr Grantham on up Norseman TI 10/57
Sep 5th 1957 61453 on 8.15p.m. KX-York class C TI 11/57
Oct 26th 1957 76114 u.i.d. up freight RO 12/57
It would seem that B16s were quite frequent on these fast freights in 1957, and also occasional appearances by then brand new Standards.
Nothing on Britannias just yet, but they had yet to be displaced by EE Type 4s on Liverpool Street - Norwich services, so maybe 1958/9/60 might begin to turn something up.
