Late nineteenth century drivers and engines

[richard]

Here's a press release about the closure and plans for the archives:

http://www.nrm.org.uk/research/index.asp

When it re-opens in late 2007, you should be able to just drop in without an appointment!

Richard

[Barbara Pearce]

I have just started to transcribe one of Driver Johnson Kirton's Log books. I was fascinated to see on December 6th 1887 the following: Tue night cleaned engine 790 Hardwicke. On Frid night cleaned Engine 1212 Pioneer. He seems to have been on a series of nights on each of which he was cleaning an engine, mainly denoted by their numbers and only occasionally also named. I see he was working on December 24th and 26th, 27th etc. No fortnights off for Christmas then!. Other engines mentioned are 1517 Princess Helena (which he seems to have had care of for a considerable period) and 1525 Abercrombie, 1523 Marlborough, 265 Pheasant, 1677 Badger (or Badayor).
He also mentions being "c/o Special for GNR 5 miles"
Does any of this help identify for whom and perhaps where he worked?

A second question I would like ot have advice on please. I know that Johnson's grandmother was an Alice Johnson. Other cousins were also given the name Johnson. What is known of Samuel Waite Johnson's family - or is that not a queation for this forum.

I do hope that one of you can advise me further.

Many thanks.
Barbara

[x568wcn]

I notice there that he cleaned Hardwick, still on the turrntable in the NRM

Yes no fortnights off then, there was work to do then, not just jumping in a cab and turning it on.
looking through yeadons, A4 4482 Golden Eagle;
Doncaster 31/12/1936 Light Overhaul
Doncaster 28/12/1937 - 29/01/1938 General Overhaul

and 5 of the A4s were condemed on 29/12/1962, no stopping then

and you have to remeber a Steam Engine can't be locked up like a diesel can, and with so many of them, they wouldn't all be shedded!

[richard]

Hardwicke was an LNWR engine - as Mark says, it can be found in York if you want to see it. A famous engine.

I have a page on S.W.Johnson:

http://www.lner.info/eng/johnson.shtml

His son (James) also had LNER connections - being connected with the Great North of Scotland Railway.

SWJohnson is more closely connected with the Midland Railway. This has its fan followings, and there should be a historical society for the Midland Railway that might be able to help with more info. The NRM in York would also be able to help. He's one of the more famous British locomotive designers, so there's a good chance that a biography has been published for him.


Richard.

[x568wcn]

If you can't get to York, then look at my section on Hardwicke
http://www.yorksteam.co.uk/pages/improv ... /index.asp

[Colombo]

Barbara,

I did not realise that you had his log books as well. This is most interesting.

For a young man wishing to become an engine driver, the career path that he had to follow was well established. First of all he had to do well at school, be good at maths and English and show enthusiasm and promise. With the LNWR and all the other railways, you had to start at the bottom and work your way up.

A certain degree of physical strength is required to work on the locomotives, so for a youth a job would often be found as a messenger boy, or a porter for example, working around the station running messages, helping the man with the oil lights, helping around the signal box and so on. In this way he got to know about railways.

At some stage he would be able to apply for a vacancy as a cleaner. This did not have to be local to his home, he may have to take lodgings, or travel to work by train on a free pass. If there was no convenient train, a long bike ride could be involved. A cleaner got to know engines by cleaning them, every part of them. At the same time there were engines to be coaled, ash pits to be emptied, and sand boxes to be filled. He would have to clean all the various types of un-named goods and local passenger locos that vastly outnumbered the named passenger locomotives that you have mentioned. I do not have a reference book that records the names and numbers and details of all the various LNWR engines but these do exist.

Engine cleaners often worked through the night. Passenger engines went out clean every day.

Mutual improvement classes had to be attended. The technology of steam locomotion would be studied, and soon the cleaner would be able to learn how to be a fireman on shunting and other light duties. Eventually he would be examined and if proved proficient, he would become a passed cleaner, and allowed to fill in when a fireman was required for local goods and passenger trains. After a year or two, he would be examined again and with luck, and a following wind, he could become a fireman. All the time he was learning from his drivers about the routes, the signalling and all the rules of the railway.

He would be paired with a regular driver and they would work together for many years. On examination, a fireman could become a passed fireman, and be allowed out on local duties in charge of a locomotive. He would eventually be able to apply for a job as a driver starting on a local link and working up to the top link on the shed which involved driving the express passenger trains.

The whole process from lad porter to driver could take 20 or more years.

So Johnson Kirton started off as a cleaner, keeping a log of the most interesting locomotives that he had polished. He would be expected to study and understand their various components and he and his log book would be examined by his superiors to assess his suitability for becoming a fireman.

He was certainly working for the LNWR, but I have not been able to establish at which loco depot from the information supplied. There are others in the LNWR Society who could help you.

Carry on transcribing his log books, they would be most interesting to see (in print?).

Colombo

[Colombo]

Barbara,

The LNWR Society web page publishes a photo of 1525 Abercrombie at Monument Lane Loco Shed:

http://www.lnwrs.org.uk/Members/Jour030 ... 309p05.php

They also have photos in their archives of 1517, Princess Helena; 1677, Badajos and 265, Thomas Carlysle. These were improved Precedent 2-4-0s in 1914. When Mr Kirton cleaned them, the names and numbers may have been allocated to other locomotives that were subsequently renewed.

May I suggest that you now contact their Archivist, Dave Pennington through the above web site.

Colombo

[Barbara Pearce]

Thank you all so much for the interest and advice.

I have now to work out the time lines and see exactly where he was living at vaaarious points now that I have found a date for his log - not until I reached the middle of one of them did I find a year mentioned.

Regards to all,
Barbara