Whose kits are these please?

[amdaley]

Hello Everyone.
Can someone tell me whose kits are these please?
Thank you.

[Atlantic 3279]

They are not kits. It appears to me that they are a pair of Triang (and its successors) GWR style short clerestory coach bodies, repainted, fitted with new plastikard roofs, cobbled together into a mock/fantasy LNER artic twin, using by the look of it some Bachmann BR Mk1 bogies and oddments to represent underframe fittings. I saw this item advertised too!
I guess the intention was to represent one of the sets of pre-group coaches that were "modernised" by articulation. The pictured coach bodies, had they been modified a bit more to rearrange the guards duckets, the luggage doors, and to remove the curly GWR grab handles, are actually not far off certain Edwardian GCR clerestory and suburban coach diagrams, especially with the kind of roof that the builder/converter appears to have tried to portray. The BR Mk1 bogies are, oddly enough, not too far removed in appearance from the bogies that were used under those coaches too. BUT, I am NOT aware that any of those GC coaches were converted into artic twins. I think that articulation was mostly applied to old GNR six wheel (and maybe rigid eight wheel) coach sets to improve the ride and maybe to make them generally better vehicles on the track, plus reduce the dead-weight and rolling resistance. Former Railmotor bodies were also paired into branch line coaching sets in this way.

[amdaley]

Cheers for that.

[Atlantic 3279]

No problem. Before I'm corrected by others, maybe I should also acknowledge that now I have looked again, maybe the roofs are from Ratio kits or similar, rather than plain plastikard.

[wehf100]

'Atlantic' is bang on. I should add that the GCR Rolling Stock Trust are restoring one of these Robinson carriages that he is referring to. There are some details here; http://www.gcr-rollingstocktrust.co.uk/ ... output.asp

Curiously the GCR decided to build some of these carriages with clerestorys as well as those with eliptical roofs which seem quite nicely represented on your model.

Finally, on a personal note, I have comitted this modelling subterfuge in the past and found it very satsifactory. I used cast bogies on mine, but I'm not sure an appropriate GCR bogie is available now. Any one know?

Will

[Atlantic 3279]

I reckon it is a pretty legitimate subterfuge to use the Triang clerestories, appropriately modified, as GCR stock. Mine have had more work done to the sides and the ends. I've created new underframe details to match drawings and photos, formed new roofs from plastikard, and they ride on modified mk1 bogies. As you'll see, I altered the representation of bracing and bolster springing on the bogies, using Hornby bogies in two cases and Bachmann spares in the third as I was working from bits rather than complete coaches by that stage. I think my brake-third is pretty accurate, the full-third too as it is made from two passenger portions of brake thirds. My composite is a bit of a grey area, as the bodywork is probably correct for a full first. I am imagining that part of the coach has been downgraded to third status to make it a more useful vehicle on branch line services. The bodies are actually all a bit wide. I stopped short of cutting them down to correct this, although I know somebody who did that too.

[S.A.C. Martin]

That is lovely work Graeme - gives me some ideas for the blood/custard set of clerestories I have knocking around! How long would these (or similar coaches?) have lasted in service?

[Atlantic 3279]

From memory alone, I suspect that many made it to nationalisation but may well have been on the least prestigious services by that time - quiet country branches, provincial suburban services, workmen's trains etc. I imagine that in common with most surviving pre-group stock they disappeared rapidly as introduction of Thompson stock and Mk1s allowed other ex-mainline coaches to be cascaded down to secondary services, and as road transport ate into rail services more and more.

[wehf100]

Simierski- The aforementioned GCR clerestory non-corridor stock survived until the mid 50s, but they would have been withdrawn either in LNER 'teak' finish, or plain BR Crimson if they were non-corridor stock.

There's some great photos of pre-group stock awaiting their fate in the 1950s on Paul Bartlett's site.

http://gallery6801.fotopic.net/c850046.html

Will

[amdaley]

Thanks to everyone who replied & for the information provided.
Regards.

[S.A.C. Martin]

Thanks Graeme and wehf - some excellent information and pics there!

I think some scalpel work, and some BR carmine is in order...!

[Atlantic 3279]

I noticed a picture this evening of just such a coach on a local service near Leeds, said to have been taken in 1954, so that should suit a devotee of Copley Hill quite nicely.

[S.A.C. Martin]

I noticed a picture this evening of just such a coach on a local service near Leeds, said to have been taken in 1954, so that should suit a devotee of Copley Hill quite nicely.

Sorry for late response Graeme - thanks for that, nice to know the planned cut and shut might have some more basis in reality!

[Alpineman]

Atlantic

Please could you say how you formed the curved Plastkard roofs on these coaches, as I would like to do something similar? I have a rake of these coaches in "teak" plastic, but they look so toy-like and distinctively old-school Triang that nobody would be fooled.

I didn't know that they could be turned into ex-GCR coaches, but I probably won't go the "whole hog" as you have done to make them such. However, I thought that with different roofs, some interiors and a repaint, they could pass as generic old wooden coaches for a branch line somewhere. Many thanks.

Alpineman

[Atlantic 3279]

Okay, I'll try to remeber to describe the method, and some alternatives that might be better, in due course. If I forget, please give me a nudge!