Returning to Grantham

[strang steel]

Sorry, but I purposely excluded preserved locos because the list could continue until the present day.

therefore 60103 ceases to be a candidate after Jan 63

[strang steel]

Further to the last steam workings at Grantham, I have checked my records as I was a regular on the platforms at that time. Unfortunately I didn’t record the dates so I have listed the following observations. To narrow it down I have researched the locomotive withdrawal dates and last shed allocation using britishsteam.com. If we add that I did not visit Grantham before April 1964, when I moved with my parents to Radcliffe on Trent, then the time period is narrowed down. I have also listed some interesting diesel workings at the same time. The Class 33s on the Cliffe –Uddingston cement working which also caused the early demise of DP2, also listed. The one and only time I saw a ‘Baby Deltic’ at work is shown. It was particularly unusual for these ill fated locomotives to work this far north and D5908 was immaculate on this day! The numbers are in groups spotted on the same day. It is noticeable how some days were better than others as far as steam were concerned, group e being particularly good!
a) 92187 Colwick 2/65, 61223 Immingham 1/66, 92191 Colwick 12/65, 92189 12/65. (Time span: 4/64-2/65)
b) 92186 Langwith Junction 8/65 (Time span: 4/64-8/65)
c) 61107 Doncaster 8/65, 43065 Colwick 1/65. (Time span: 4/64-1/65)
d) 61250 Doncaster 4/66 (Time span: 4/64-4/66)
e) 43092 Stavely (Barrow Hill) 4/65, D5908, 61302 Colwick 4/66, 92041 Langwith Junction 8/65, 92146 Doncaster 4/66, 92180 Langwith Junction 5/65, D6580,DP2. 90048* (Time span: 4/64-4/65)
f) D6564, 92044 Langwith Junction 4/65, 4472 (reason for visit), 43060 Colwick 12/64,
92141 Colwick 12/65. (Time span: 4/64-12/64)
g) 61361 Colwick 12/65, D6507. (Time span: 4/64-12/65)
*90048 was recorded but according to records was withdrawn 5/63 and disposed of 6/63. I can only assume this is my mistake. I’m sorry I cannot be precise date wise but it may provoke some memories!

Your observation of a Baby Deltic has maybe confirmed what I saw in 1965/6 when leaving Grantham on a Boston bound dmu. I have been branded a cheat from various quarters for even daring to suggest that I saw one that far north (other than being towed to works which seemed to be done mainly after dark).

I lost my notes, and saw most of the class at Kings Cross, so I cant remember which one it was, but thanks for making me feel honest after all these years.

[StevieG]

Whatever that 'Baby Deltic' train was (it was on a train?), its running through there could have been one of those 'last resort' occasions for available motive power.
Once or twice while I was on the KX Control Office desk that dealt with allocating locos at Peterborough, circumstances conspired that we had to scrape the bottom of a barrel to power one of the morning peak loco-hauled Up 'parlys' to KX, in only having a 25 available, so rather than cancel, even though time loss in running was guaranteed, on she went !

[hq1hitchin]

Further to the last steam workings at Grantham, I have checked my records as I was a regular on the platforms at that time. Unfortunately I didn’t record the dates so I have listed the following observations. To narrow it down I have researched the locomotive withdrawal dates and last shed allocation using britishsteam.com. If we add that I did not visit Grantham before April 1964, when I moved with my parents to Radcliffe on Trent, then the time period is narrowed down. I have also listed some interesting diesel workings at the same time. The Class 33s on the Cliffe –Uddingston cement working which also caused the early demise of DP2, also listed. The one and only time I saw a ‘Baby Deltic’ at work is shown. It was particularly unusual for these ill fated locomotives to work this far north and D5908 was immaculate on this day! The numbers are in groups spotted on the same day. It is noticeable how some days were better than others as far as steam were concerned, group e being particularly good!
a) 92187 Colwick 2/65, 61223 Immingham 1/66, 92191 Colwick 12/65, 92189 12/65. (Time span: 4/64-2/65)
b) 92186 Langwith Junction 8/65 (Time span: 4/64-8/65)
c) 61107 Doncaster 8/65, 43065 Colwick 1/65. (Time span: 4/64-1/65)
d) 61250 Doncaster 4/66 (Time span: 4/64-4/66)
e) 43092 Stavely (Barrow Hill) 4/65, D5908, 61302 Colwick 4/66, 92041 Langwith Junction 8/65, 92146 Doncaster 4/66, 92180 Langwith Junction 5/65, D6580,DP2. 90048* (Time span: 4/64-4/65)
f) D6564, 92044 Langwith Junction 4/65, 4472 (reason for visit), 43060 Colwick 12/64,
92141 Colwick 12/65. (Time span: 4/64-12/64)
g) 61361 Colwick 12/65, D6507. (Time span: 4/64-12/65)
*90048 was recorded but according to records was withdrawn 5/63 and disposed of 6/63. I can only assume this is my mistake. I’m sorry I cannot be precise date wise but it may provoke some memories!

Your observation of a Baby Deltic has maybe confirmed what I saw in 1965/6 when leaving Grantham on a Boston bound dmu. I have been branded a cheat from various quarters for even daring to suggest that I saw one that far north (other than being towed to works which seemed to be done mainly after dark).

I lost my notes, and saw most of the class at Kings Cross, so I cant remember which one it was, but thanks for making me feel honest after all these years.

[strang steel]

My goodness, I learn something new every day.

I had no idea that a Baby Deltic had ventured to the Lincolnshire Riviera.

I cant really remember what train the one I saw was on, but something in the back of my mind thinks it was a parcels train. I just assumed it had been given that job at Doncaster rather than returning light.

[deltic9013]

Glad I cleared the Baby Deltic saga up for you. I know what you mean. You start to doubt your own mind as I did with Bongrace (see earlier). When I saw 5908, it was heading North and I can still see it clearly in my mind. It was definitely pulling coaching stock or possibly a mail train. It was immaculate as I said but I wondered whether it had been on a running in turn or returning to Doncaster for more attention. Did Doncaster deal with these locos at the time or did they ever get a general overhaul other than the one that saw them extensively modified to try and make them more reliable after early withdrawal?

[Andy W]

The baby deltics were indeed shopped at Doncaster after their rebuild. The train you saw looks like a trial turn as Doncaster used stock trains to test locos in the 1960's.

I think we can narrow down the date too. D5908 was delivered from EE on 16/7/64 and worked trial trips until 18/8/64 when it was released to traffic. This sounds a long time in works but there would have been a works holiday shutdown during that period.

It didn't return to Doncaster Works until 10/6/65, then for AWS wiring work (the wiring had burnt over no 2 T/M) so I am pretty sure you saw it in July/August 1964. It didn't get another classified repair until November 1967 so the prestine paintwork really does clinch 1964 for me.

As to the last steamer through Grantham debate, Colwick had a regular steam turn to Boston until April 1966 and I suspect there may have been the odd unrecorded visitor from Nottingham to Grantham/eastwards until Colwick ran down later that year. Perhaps, with several freight workings taking place during the nocturnal hours, we will never know for sure!

[strang steel]

Would a freight trip from Colwick to Boston necessarily be routed via Grantham?

I assumed they went via Allington Junction direct to Barkston East.

[Andy W]

No, they probably went direct but my point was that there were steam workings in the vicinity of Grantham until at least April 1966 and, from the evidence of other lines (such as the MR into Peterborough) there is every likelihood that Grantham would have received an unscheduled steam visitor from the Nottingham direction sometime in 1966.

We just have to find out if and when!

[lincolnian]

I've just been reading ... again ... my copy of Peter Townend's excellent "Top Shed", in which reference is made to at least 3 issues which have been raised at various times in this thread - forgive me if this has been covered earlier but I've not spotted it.

A5 at Top Shed - there is a photo of 69814 in the exalted company of Pacifics at Top Shed with the description "Class A5 69814 was transferred from Grantham to see if this heavy Great Central design would keep its feet better than the L1. It did, but could not get up Wood Green Bank with a heavy train as it was not powerful enough."

Speed Restriction at Wood Green - also in respect of L1's struggling up the banks with heavy ECS trains, the text goes on to describe how the flyover was successfully overcome by the driver "stopping well back on the carriage road and making a flying run round the back of Wood Green station." This practice apparently worked until the District Engineer enforced a 15mph speed restriction on the back roads through Wood Green. This then entailed the testing of various types of locomotives including the A5 referred to above, L1's and B1's, with the final result that some GWR 2-8-0T's were requested (??!!) but never arrived, so King's X continued using double headed L1's.

I think it was this thread that included mention of the 9F achieving 93mph on an up express (?). Peter Townend describes how the most difficult period to cover on Saturdays in the peak summer months was around 1 to 2pm, by which time every locomotive at Top Shed had gone out but nothing was due to return until 971, the Leeds train due around 1.45pm. On one occasion, the only tender locomotive available for the 1.45pm to Grantham was the 9F, which it managed comfortably as it was a light train which stopped at various stations. However, the return leg was on the 'Heart of Midlothian'!

Finally, for the author of this thread, there is a fine photograph of 61070 double heading the 5.39 from Kings Cross to demonstrate the heavy evening suburban trains out of Kings X.

It is an excellent book and I think this is my favourite thread.

[61070]

Many thanks for your interest and appreciation lincolnian. I recall mention of Peter Townend's Top Shed many times on this forum and have often thought 'I must get hold of that sometime'. Now I'm anticipating a really good read in a few days' time, your post having been the final nudge I needed to buy a copy from an internet bookseller - at very reasonable cost too, I may say.

You mention the 90mph 9F exploit. The loco in question was 92184 and my research has revealed a number of other references to the event, e.g. The Eastern Since 1948 by G. Freeman Allen (1981, Ian Allan ISBN 0 7110 1106 0), pages 43-44, and Steam World Issue 183, September 2002 pages 21-22, and Issue 256, October 2008, pages 22-23. I followed this up because 92184 passed by on ironstone empties on 27th June 1963 and I have two photos of it at the spot where the legendary trip commenced nearly five years previously, captioned as follows:.

Two photographs of the same train of empty ironstone wagons being taken south to High Dyke by class 9F locomotive No.92184. The train is signalled onto the up goods line, which ran as far as High Dyke.

This locomotive has a particular ‘claim to fame’. It was recorded achieving a speed of 90mph at Essendine on 16th August 1958 after it was pressed into service on the southbound The Heart of Midlothian express passenger train from Grantham to London King’s Cross. As a heavy freight design these engines were not normally expected to do more than 50mph!

The term ‘Iron Ore Tippler’ indicates that the wagons have no doors – they were emptied by being tipped upside down in unloading plant at the steelworks. An example of this type of wagon is preserved by the National Railway Museum (accession number 1978-7113) and is currently displayed at Locomotion, Shildon, Co. Durham.

[elydock]

All a fantastic set of shots. As R.Pike says, the detail and quality are amazing for that period. I especially like the human element with lots of people going about their everday business but natuarlly, not posed.

Thanks for sharing.

[34F]

This has been a most wonderful thread 61070 I have found it very interesting indeed and probably like many others on here look forward to its continuation. The pictures create a fascinating portrait of the day to day life of a station with the staff from various departments all going about their business to keep the wheels turning as it were.

[61070]

Thanks elydock and 34F. I’ve been catching up with a bit of reading – including PN Townend’s Top Shed as recommended by lincolnian (and others). I’ve found it a fascinating account with a great deal of interest in relation to the period covered by our visits to Grantham and the many 34A locomotives that we saw, and there are some brilliant stories too. I’ve had the pleasure of talking to a few Grantham footplatemen who were firemen in the late 1950s and who were transferred to King’s Cross shed for a period because BR couldn’t recruit and retain sufficient firemen locally at 34A, as the author states. The Grantham lads mainly worked on the suburban traffic, though there was the occasional trip on a main line express.

Talking of the day-to-day life of a station, here are three shots which have reminded me that it wasn’t only railway staff who were continually going about their business on and around the premises. GPO staff were often to be seen ensuring that the mails were safely received and despatched. They had the use of a lock-up shed on the down platform, and there was a dedicated fleet of barrows and trolleys painted post office red. In general the GPO’s equipment seemed to be newer-looking and in better condition that that used by the railway porters. In those days no-one would have thought that long-distance mail would ever leave the railway.

[workev]

Love those people shots, they reflect what stations used to be like!

I had to travel from Thetford to Stockport on Saturday and went via Doncaster. Thetford station is a real sorry state, litter everywhere and nobody around. The only plus point is the semaphore signals on the UP platform!

Anyway on to my question. On speeding through Grantham I noticed a remnant from 34F, a brick building with complete chimney, some way south from the station. I cannot recall whether it has been mentioned before (if it has I apologise), but what was it?

Ian