Hertford Loop/Hertford North

[Moray Nichol]

Here is a Great Northern sign that I got many years ago. Until quite recently there was a similarly worded LNER sign near Gordon Hill station. It's gone now, but where ?

[gordons19]

http://richard2890.fotopic.net/p55247135.html

Palmers Green, 15 signal..

Morning gentlemen. I have only just found this site today after doing a search on Palmers Green Goods Yard. Some wonderful postings here and I'm sure I will find even more of interest as I explore further. I was brought up in Palmers Green in the 50/60’s and attended Hazlewood Lane Junior and then the last year of Southgate County in Fox Lane, before I had to travel to the new school building in Sussex Way, Oakwood every day.

My very first memories of trains came from a visit to Alexandra Palace with my Great Aunt and Uncle in the very early 50's. We must have walked from their flat in Nightingale Road to Wood Green and then took the single decker 251? up to the Palace. We went down to the small fun fair/boating lake and then I saw the miniature railway, which they took me on. I'm fairly sure it was a petrol diesel driven loco in the outline of an A4, but will have to do some more searching to confirm. It was probably 3d for the ride which took you twice around the lake.

Seeing my immediate love of a train, they took me down to Alexandra Palace Station where I saw my first real one. Memory says it was an N2/Quad Art combination. The noise and smell I can feel even today. The next stage was even better. We walked down the hill to Wood Green station to hear the sound of a chime whistle and a plume of smoke up the line at Hornsey and seconds later an A4 thundered past me on its way up north. That was it. Totally hooked on BR Eastern Region and never changed...

I was pleased to see the signal diagram of Palmers Green, but was shocked to find no sign of the Good Yard where I thought I played as a kid. The goods yard shown on the lower part of the diagram, is now a Morrisons supermarket and I certainly recall the single slip access into the yard and possibly coal staithes on the far side.

I’m sure as a kid, we went over the railway from Broomfield Lane and then in a gate the other side of the line. There was a large goods shed there and as kids we had a whale of a time clambering over that building and platform and enjoying all sorts of cowboy/war games. No one bothered us and we free as birds. I see from your diagram there is a small spur showing on the downside of the line but nothing else.

I really would be pleased to hear my mind has not been playing tricks with me after all these years if someone is able to confirm there was a platform/goods shed there.

Signal 15 which was mounted right up against the Booking Hall was the start of the excitement. Hearing the chains and rods pulling it up and then knowing a plume of smoke would appear behind the Fox Lane Bridge long before anything was visible, only raised the sense of anticipation before an N2 or L1 with Quads appeared. In those days, even as a young lad of 10, I was allowed to go to KX every Saturday and join the spotters at the end of Platform 10. It’s just a shame our kids don’t enjoy the same freedom….

[chaz harrison]

Morning Gordon,

Something you might not have realised - Signal Box diagrams don't usually show the track in goods yards. There would be no signals and the pointwork would be operated with hand levers, so the signalman would only control the connection from the yard onto the running lines. This would usually be protected by a ground disc (dolly).

Chaz

[gordons19]

Good grief, that was quick!

Thanks for that Chaz, I hadn't realised that. I'd still love to hear more about that yard and it certainly seems there are guys on here who may recall more. Just glad my mind is not playing tricks on me...

[Flamingo]

http://richard2890.fotopic.net/p55247135.html

Palmers Green, 15 signal..

Morning gentlemen. I have only just found this site today after doing a search on Palmers Green Goods Yard. Some wonderful postings here and I'm sure I will find even more of interest as I explore further. I was brought up in Palmers Green in the 50/60’s and attended Hazlewood Lane Junior and then the last year of Southgate County in Fox Lane, before I had to travel to the new school building in Sussex Way, Oakwood every day.

My very first memories of trains came from a visit to Alexandra Palace with my Great Aunt and Uncle in the very early 50's. We must have walked from their flat in Nightingale Road to Wood Green and then took the single decker 251? up to the Palace. We went down to the small fun fair/boating lake and then I saw the miniature railway, which they took me on. I'm fairly sure it was a petrol diesel driven loco in the outline of an A4, but will have to do some more searching to confirm. It was probably 3d for the ride which took you twice around the lake.

Seeing my immediate love of a train, they took me down to Alexandra Palace Station where I saw my first real one. Memory says it was an N2/Quad Art combination. The noise and smell I can feel even today. The next stage was even better. We walked down the hill to Wood Green station to hear the sound of a chime whistle and a plume of smoke up the line at Hornsey and seconds later an A4 thundered past me on its way up north. That was it. Totally hooked on BR Eastern Region and never changed...

I was pleased to see the signal diagram of Palmers Green, but was shocked to find no sign of the Good Yard where I thought I played as a kid. The goods yard shown on the lower part of the diagram, is now a Morrisons supermarket and I certainly recall the single slip access into the yard and possibly coal staithes on the far side.

I’m sure as a kid, we went over the railway from Broomfield Lane and then in a gate the other side of the line. There was a large goods shed there and as kids we had a whale of a time clambering over that building and platform and enjoying all sorts of cowboy/war games. No one bothered us and we free as birds. I see from your diagram there is a small spur showing on the downside of the line but nothing else.

I really would be pleased to hear my mind has not been playing tricks with me after all these years if someone is able to confirm there was a platform/goods shed there.

Signal 15 which was mounted right up against the Booking Hall was the start of the excitement. Hearing the chains and rods pulling it up and then knowing a plume of smoke would appear behind the Fox Lane Bridge long before anything was visible, only raised the sense of anticipation before an N2 or L1 with Quads appeared. In those days, even as a young lad of 10, I was allowed to go to KX every Saturday and join the spotters at the end of Platform 10. It’s just a shame our kids don’t enjoy the same freedom….

Gordon, our paths may well have crossed at some stage - I also lived in PG ( though in fact our road was the first one in Southgate N14) and went to Hazlewood Lane school, but I left in 1950 so might be just before your time. My next school was Minchenden but my bro went to at S County and spent his last year at their new premises in Sussex Way. Did you know the old SC building in Fox Lane was then taken over by Minchenden Lower School?

As for PG goods yard, I think the signal box diagram showd part of it, a couple of sidings at least on the up side just south of the station, though I seem to remember there could have been more sidings which are not on the diagram. I can remember watching J6's shunting coal wagons there, always with a lot of squealing as they went over the points and curves at low speed. As you say, the site is now built on.

On the down side opposite the goods yard I believe there was a single siding with some kind of long shelter with a canopy where timber was stored under cover. I don't ever recall seeing any wagons in this siding and I don't think it is on the signalling diagram, probably for the reasons Chaz mentions.

Oh and by the way, does anyone on here have a photograph of a Palmers Green BR totem type sign in Eastern Region dark blue colours (the 1950s 'double sausage' type) as used on stations? I would like to get some made up for myself and brother, Can't afford the real thing but there's a company on EBay that makes them in self-adhesive plastic. Or can anyone remember how the PG totems were worded: did they just say 'PALMERS GREEN' or was there also 'AND SOUTHGATE' perhaps in smaller letters below the PG name?

[AndyRush]

Some photos from the archive - first two dated 28.03.1971, last one 27.05.1973

Andy

[AndyRush]

Number 2

[AndyRush]

Number 3

[gordons19]

I was at Hazlewood from 53-58 and then went to Fox Lane in 59 and finally to Sussex Way in September 1960. I wonder if you also recall the model railway shows that were held in Lacey Hall? They were rum by the North Middlesex MRC that I later joined.

I really seem to recall there were two lines on that side of the shed, but memories play funny tricks on you. We used to use the covered area as a starting point for all sorts of games and no one ever bothered us.

It was the same when we were bunking into Hornsey or KX sheds. Drivers, Firemen and Foremen never really paid much attention as we wandered around collecting numbers. H & S would have a fit now at the thought of small kids wandering round steam sheds....

Edit: Those pics just show the shed behind the signal box, but the lines joining this area to the running lines appear to have been lifted. I would have been there around 56-58.

Thanks for those pics Andy...

[Flamingo]

Yes, 3 good pictures there Andy. No. 2 shows the wood shed or whatever it was on the down side south of PG box. Looks like it could have been a platform with tracks either side. I never saw an engine or wagons on that side of the running lines. There was timber stored under that canopy in the early 1950s but those sidings saw very little use.

Gordon, no I was never into model railways so did not go to any shows. You were lucky if you used to get round Kings Cross shed unchallenged, it was usually difficult to bunk and once the BTC even threw me off the approach ramp which led down into the yard from York Way. At the time I wasn't even intending to bunk 34A, just scanning with binoculars. Hornsey wasn't too bad though.

When the main line trains were diverted via the Hertford Loop at weekends we used to buy platform tickets and just watch all afternoon on PG station itself, or from the footbridge just north of the station before the Fox Lane overbridge.

[gordons19]

I used to go into KX via the back way. Out of the station and hard right past the goods stores and coal drops where they filmed Alfie, past the gasometer and then down the side of the canal and up over the footbridge. From memory again, there was a gate house there, but I never seemed to have a problem. Perhaps I was just lucky....

Great days.

[chaz harrison]

As I have said before on forum my dad used to cycle into "Top Shed" wearing his blue boiler suit during his lunch hours. He said thet he felt part of the scenery and was never challenged. That was before the arrival of the J50s and Peppercorn A1s.

Chaz