Atlantic's works: Portable layout - Scenic details next

[JASd17]

Oh, to do a bit of time-travelling with a digital camera. Plenty of cards and batteries required!

Which Diagram Jonathan? Plus as built or with re-modelled windows on certain types?

John

[65447]

My ultimate intention is to use the multi-part "master" sides to create moulds in which whole sides can be cast in resin in a single piece, for greater strength. I might cast in some metal reinforcement too. Trial and error will reveal the pros and cons. Results of this attempt, combined with availability of time and remaining motivation will determine whether sides for other carriages are also produced. I'm afraid that "complete kits" are certainly NOT part of my faint, sketchy plan. Should anybody want similar parts from me, they will need to do their own research, make decisions regarding standards and techniques, decide what else to use, obtain other parts, and tackle any problems that arise. But what could possibly go wrong??

Shades of Ian Kirk's 7mm scale parts; lots of standard components to make up numerous carriage types. Principal differences are (1) injection moulded styrene, and (2) restrictions on the size of individual components, such that only relatively short part sides are possible.

[Atlantic 3279]

My original preference was for a 12 wheeled restaurant car of a type that might still have been seen on the GN and GC sections in the mid 30s. I then looked through Hoole's book on the ECJS vehicles and noted that the restaurant composites all went to either the GC section or the Southern Scottish area when displaced from ECJS lists in the 1920s, none going to the GN. My thoughts then turned to the idea of one of the restaurant firsts with the same window style, with a view to running it paired with a pantry third. That, I thought, might give me something "properly" suitable for either my home layout concept (GN and GC sections) or Grantham. As John has observed above of course, the next fly in the ointment was the discovery that the restaurant firsts all appear to have been rebuilt with large windows for the dining saloons, from as early a date as 1911. That would not only make it more important in my mind to produce a good model of the more visible interior in the that area, but it would create the additional unwanted challenge of modelling some of those large windows with a decent representation of glass louvres at the top! Hence I reverted to the idea of a composite, and selected the type that went to the GC rather than the Southern Scottish - they might still have appeared at Grantham on occasions. I did waver slightly at the last minute after noticing a pure GNR restaurant composite No 2994 in a picture in J. Crawley's " The Great Northern Railway in Focus". It had the same style of windows too, but (inevitably) a significantly different layout compared to the ECJS vehicles, and I had only one picture of one side of that vehicle. There's still no handy book (yet?) to consult on GN carriages built in the pre-Gresley era and I didn't really want to start chasing up more drawings and photographs from multiple sources, if any could in fact be found. As I already had drawings to show both sides of the ECJS Dia. 79 carriage (confirming incidentally that the sides are not pure mirror images, unlike the Peter K etches that seem to attempt to represent this type of vehicle) I decided to push ahead with that one and see what could be achieved. My sides faithfully follow the non-mirrored layout in the drawings, and include the inset doors....

That said, there will still be faults for the avid observer to find.

[Atlantic 3279]

Master sides, cut and shut generic resin clerestory roof and previous-pattern resin ends lashed together with sellotape to check size and fit, on a basic floor and solebars unit made up from thick plasticard sheet and plastruct Z sections:

Provision within the ends for eventually screwing the body to the floor unit:

Altering the clerestory sides to exact pattern will be too much of a chore, but I'll alter or fill in some of the piercings to get something akin to the true layout, with its excess of torpedo vents - unless somebody shows me that the vents were reduced in number at some stage. I've also done a small experiment to try out a glazing technique for the clerestory, but that doesn't merit a photograph yet.

[mick b]

Very nice !!

[manna]

G'Day Gents

Love it.

manna

[Atlantic 3279]

Thanks Gents.

Moving from roof detail to underframe, does anybody know please, whether these restaurant composites retained only gas tanks to the end, or were they partly or fully re-equipped for use of electrickery at some some stage?

[Dave]

Brilliant

[iainkirk]

Now that rocks...

[Chas Levin]

Gorgeous - and I'd certainly be interested in possible parts availablility please

Chas

[Atlantic 3279]

I have more progress than this to show, but time does not permit me to do so at this stage...

Cut and shut extended roof now with clerestory apertures altered to better resemble those of the specific type of carriage. Some were blocked of fully with rectangles of plasticard, some closed off in part, and some of the original moulded uprights were cut out or trimmed back. Apart from the battle against time, I did not want to cut out more of the original material in order to get a completely true window layout as I did not want to risk losing the original shape and strength of the one-piece casting. Unaltered spare raw roof casting with flash across all apertures also in view for comparison.

RTV rubber mould prepared from one master side, including plug-in top piece producing correct thicknesses of the side in the relevant places:

Experience with other long shallow moulds told me to make a rigid base with raised edge in which the mould could sit, held dead straight, flat, and not accidentally stretched beyond its intended length. The base of plasticard is covered by a layer of sellotape to prevent firm adhesion of resin overspill.

[Atlantic 3279]

First three attempts at a one-piece side casting in that new mould, top one first, bottom one third:

The first attempt was very much a case of "mix up the estimated quantity of resin and pour it all into the mould without much fore-thought". I used Phoenix Precison Teak paint as a colourant in the resin, and mixing the whole quantity in one go left me with too little time to coax the resin into, and the air out of all corners and recesses as well as get the top onto the mould correctly. Although the resin found its way into most of the front surface features, the beading was spoiled in one or two places by tiny air pockets. Also one small area showed badly mixed (note the white streak) and lastingly sticky resin.

The rear face was a total mess, time running out as the resin thickened to such an extent that my final efforts to assist the distribution of the resin left ridges and troughs in the surface...

Second time around I split the process into two phases, mixing and pouring a small quantity of resin first and getting this to coat the surface of the mould in a thin layer. I also switched back to Humbrol enamel to colour the resin (gloss 9 and a little black) both to try the colour and to avoid any possible acceleration of the reaction that the Precision paint might have caused. I managed to capture all of the beading this time, but got two or three annoying air pockets in the bars across the windows, thus weakening them. The slower reaction in the initial thin layer was however a big advantage, as was the further time won by using a second pour of resin to fill up the mould, this remaining easily "liquid enough" to allow me to roll the top out gently on the mould without trapping air, and then to press it down properly to get the correct cast thickness.

Sufficiently encouraged by that result I had a third go, with slightly altered resin volumes and a more carefully thought-out approach to the releasing of air bubbles from the window bars. I even put a strip of 0.45mm brass wire into the whole long line of window bars and a length of 0.9mm brass wire into the lower side at the level of the middle beading as a stiffener. I tried Humbrol 113 to colour the resin this time.

I felt there was still room for improvement in the way I was weighting down the top of the mould, it being desirable to get the exact side thickness and the thinnest possible flash across the windows. I also thought it desirable to stiffen the cant-rail with 0.7mm brass wire, but took care to arrange this so as not to finish up in the outer edge of the cant rail nor to continue across the tops of the doorways where it may be desirable to trim away the cant rail. Here are the moulds with the wires tried in place:

[Atlantic 3279]

I was certainly satisfied with the fourth attempt at casting the side. Here's the side (with flash not yet removed from the windows) lashed in place against the coach floor and ends, with the modified roof also in place, clerestory sides given an undercoat of Humbrol 113 to match the resin side.

With results to justify some of the effort with the first side, I've now gone on to mould production for the second side, with the aid of a just-in-time delivery of more RTV rubber early this afternoon.

[will5210]

Very clever

[ufothth]

Hi,

I can't personal message Graeme King as I seem to have been refreshed as a new member when I try to contact him. I was looking to buy more parts for Thompson A2 Pacifics after completing my A2/3 "Herringbone" Bachmann conversion bought from Graeme some time ago. Can anyone help regarding price list of currently available parts.

Many thanks

Brian