LNER branchline passenger stock

[Bryan]

Could the alternating circuit workings be explained by on Day 1 circuit 103 returns first into siding then 104 comes in on top.
Next day Circuit 103 is required to be first out, but train sets are identical so which one does not matter, so last train in First out. 104 becomes 103 etc.

[1H was 2E]

Good observation Bryan. Looking though the book, there is for instance a number of Doncaster-based circuits, (to different destinations and therefore with different mileages) that are shown as 'works daily' (i.e., stayed on the same circuit) so your suggestion seems very likely. Belgrave Road had, I think, quite a compact layout
On another tangent, I wonder whether the annotation of numbers of compartments in each coach was to facilitate the steady replacement of 4 and 6 wheel stock by bogie stock, so that the accommodation would remain the same. I read somewhere recently that the LNER before the war had more 4 and 6 wheel passenger stock than the other three companies combined; and the GWR and to a lesser extent the LMS had some pretty desperate stock for workers' (particularly miners') trains, so that's saying something.
There's also some odd seeming stuff; a Derby-Basford circuit is shown as Quad BCL-CGL-T-BT (had to look that up!) and a quint with one T(8) and one T(9) (or maybe it was (7) and (8))- although I now can't find that again. The articulated sets with more than two coaches seem to be so varied that each combination must have had very few examples, and the Western Section Southern Area book to which I was referring had a lot of artic. stock shown.

[robertcwp]

The book in question - Western Section - Southern Area - commencing 6 October 1947 - is available here:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/327 ... -10-47.pdf

[1H was 2E]

Thanks for that, Robert.
I have an original, and the quality of paper used was probably not intended for continual reference 67 years later. I've always felt obliged to treat it with reverence; now I can browse a PDF file with no guilt.
Probably try to sell my copy now...

[robertcwp]

Thanks for that, Robert.
I have an original, and the quality of paper used was probably not intended for continual reference 67 years later. I've always felt obliged to treat it with reverence; now I can browse a PDF file with no guilt.
Probably try to sell my copy now...

My copy was rescued from being thrown onto a bonfire by someone who then put it on eBay a few years ago. They are rare. I have never seen one for any of the following three timetables, ie Summer 1948, Winter 1948-9 or Summer 1949 and nothing for earlier years except one from the Summer of 1945, which is in a society collection.

[1H was 2E]

It seems a shame that 3 copies (yours, mine, and the one used to photocopy) of this particular edition survived, but none from the adjacent years. In my case it would have been unwise to 'souveneer' too many docs from the office bookcase, and the last LNER one seemed to be the best to go for; maybe this was also the reason for the others' survival.
Another very absorbing booklet I rescued (a sort of freight equivalent of the carriage circular) is titled BR /EASTERN OPERATING AREA / BOOKLET OF FREIGHT TRAIN MARSHALLING ARRANGEMENTS / AND OF / BOOKED SHUNTING and TRAVELLING PILOTS (PASSENGER and FREIGHT), etc. /// DONCASTER DISTRICT / KING'S CROSS DISTRICT / LEEDS DISTRICT / LINCOLN DISTRICT / MANCHESTER DISTRICT / NOTTINGHAM DISTRICT (phew!) and if anyone wishes to borrow in order to photocopy and make available online, they are welcome to do so. Also some BR era carriage marshalling books, including an ER one (I think).

[Atso]

Thank you, yes, it was a triplet to:
BT-C-BT
These were also rostered over the London branches (I have better pictures of the older quad-art sets). My understanding is that the triplet in the picture was made up from:
42'11 5/8" BT
34'2 1/2" C
34'10 1/2" BT
of which weren't the latter two 6w?

Ahem, I did quote Casserley's name and his date of 1937!

Another good source, arguably the finest, is Terry Henderson's for the GNRS in a series of spiral bound booklets: the Twins and Triplets one is an inch thick.

Here is an ER Wethersett view from 1938, also near Mill Hill that shows the aforementioned quad-art:

Sorry to resurrect this thread after such a long time, however I do have a question about the above quad set. Would these sets have been used on the ECML north of Finsbury Park in the 1930s? They make such a nice contrast to the later GNR and LNER sets and something that I would love to see running on my Hadley Wood layout just to be a bit different.

[JASd17]

Atso,

It depends when.

In the September 1935 CWB there is a triplet set Diagram 218K in the 10.50am Down, which is there a year later and I think still around in 1939 too. This rather humble train was a KX Pacific turn.

In 1935 there is a Howlden Quad set, not sure of the Diagram yet, in the 2.30pm Down from KX. The corresponding Up service was the 11.1am from Hitchin. There is a photo of this train in Part 3A fig 51, showing a C2 hauling the 2.30pm. This had been replaced by twins by 1936-7.

Hope this helps.

John

[Atso]

Hi John,

Yes, that is most helpful. Thank you for coming back to me so quickly. As I'm modelling a ten year(ish) period from c. 1929-1939 (accepting that'll I'll have to decide on the pre or post 1932 signaling and track layout), I can justify running these sets. Thanks for pointing out fig 51 in the RTCS series, I use these books a lot for locomotive reference but, apparently, pay little attention to anything else in the photographs!

I assume that I could make a reasonable representation of these articulated coaches using the Isinglass drawing sets.

Thanks once again.

[manna]

G'Day Gents

The Edgware sets, we're mostly used on the Finchley - Edgware shuttle, I 'Think' the Quad Arts we're used on the through service's to KX, as the older units were moved away (or scrapped, ex six wheelers and rigid eight wheelers) the Quad Arts took over everything.

Also, the Artic stock on the Edgware branch, was serviced at Finsbury Pk on Sundays, when mainline stock was pressed into service.

manna

[Atso]

Thanks for that Manna. I'm looking for some different bits and pieces to run on Hadley Wood and I love the roof profiles of the Howlden coaches. I guess I'm going to have to get hold of a copy of the CWB which I assume is going to yet another very good reason why I should finally join the LNER Society!

[JASd17]

Ask Robert Carroll 'robertcwp' of this parish about GN Section carriage working books.

John

[john coffin]

Some of you might be interested to know that in fact that is the Edgware quad, which certainly ran into the late 1930's.
Behind it is a Triplet of the same type, but not knowingly an Edgware item.

it is probably a weekend working, and may even have been on a day trip somewhere.

Paul

[Atso]

Some of you might be interested to know that in fact that is the Edgware quad, which certainly ran into the late 1930's.
Behind it is a Triplet of the same type, but not knowingly an Edgware item.

it is probably a weekend working, and may even have been on a day trip somewhere.

Paul

Thanks Paul,

So the Edgware quad was made up of a single set and not two sets like the mine line stock?

All interesting stuff!