West Coast Franchise

[60041]

It looks like Branson was right all along, yet another government cock-up:
http://www.dft.gov.uk/news/press-releas ... -20121003a

[Mickey]

Deleted

[52A]

Yes another excellent example of how our railways have been messed up, we now have to repay £40 million for nothing. There were, I believe, 4 bidders so £10 million each, how does it cost this much to put a bid together, who gets this money? The bigger question is who pays for these bids in the long run? Must be the mugs who part with their money to travel by train!

[marksouthcoast]

Dose this now mean a challange to the simens carriage order now? ,as well how many more cock ups are waiting to come out.

[Andy W]

I have to preface my remarks with the comment that I was heavily involved with the WC bid for a certain bidder so I cannot comment on recent events, much as though I would like to.

The reason it costs so much to put a bid together is that it is a highly complex process which involves jumping through a considerable number of DfT procedural hoops in a particular way that the DfT mandates. This requires an enormous degree of analysis, especially if large sums are involved or there is a lot of technical detail to be included.

Most companies who bid have to use specialised consultants for a lot of this work because they don't have the resources themselves or those they do have are running the day job elsewhere or are restricted (if you are the incumbent) from being involved in the bidding process. A lot of these specialists are ex-mainstream railway people and with the amount of franchises up for grabs that means there is a shortage of them at the moment so their rates are quite high!

If the industry moved to a "concession" model where certain risks (i.e. revenue) were left with the person who lets the contract, then the costs would come right down. But then the Treasury might not be so happy as they may get less money from the whole process.

All bidding costs will always be factored into the bidders margin, unless you are loss leading to gain market share.

Whether this is all bonkers is something I again cannot comment on (although again I would like to) because city analysts and speculators thrive on this kind of stuff but it all seems a world away from my early days on the KX Division!

[Autocar Publicity]

I propose a new motto for the WCML trains: Cui bono...?

[2002EarlMarischal]

Perhaps a better model would be to have say 4 regional companies responsible for track, services and their own rolling stock?

Seems familiar!

[Mickey]

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[2512silverfox]

There was a leader in the Business section of the DT which alleged that RB had warned that if he lost the WC franchise, he would cut airfares drastically on the above mentioned routes. All seems to be fair in love and war!

[Mickey]

Deleted

[Iron Duke]

Once had a vivid dream many years ago that the whole British Railways System had been replicated as a 00 model railway.
(A lot of space was required, but in dreams that sort of detail does not seem to matter does it).

Every locomotive had been brought back to life and ran on the "layout" as a model, to a timetable.......?

Just think of the locations that could be revisited (in just a short walk) no crime, no squabbles, constant summer Saturdays...

Utopia, just reaching for my old ABC...... or is this just virgin on the ridiculous

If only........

[Blink Bonny]

Ay up!

What I don't understand is this.

The whole process is politically motivated and politically driven. The Ministers are (allegedly) organising this and instructing their Civil Servants to proceed in a certain manner.

Am I right so far?

OK, I will continue.

If Ministers are in charge and Instructing Civil Servants, why are senior Civil Servants the ones carrying the can? Or is this a new demonstration of shifting the blame downwards?

Me?

Cynical?

[52A]

Ay up!

What I don't understand is this.

The whole process is politically motivated and politically driven. The Ministers are (allegedly) organising this and instructing their Civil Servants to proceed in a certain manner.

Am I right so far?

OK, I will continue.

If Ministers are in charge and Instructing Civil Servants, why are senior Civil Servants the ones carrying the can? Or is this a new demonstration of shifting the blame downwards?

Me?

Cynical?

But they are only Plebs!

[PinzaC55]

Micky said "Branson has just cost the British tax payer between £40-50 MILLION quid!!."

Sorry to have to disagree with you Micky but its the British taxpayers fault. A majority voted Thatcher and Major in with their clearly stated privatisation policy, and then another majority voted Blair in (including me) who said he would renationalise the railways. We got what we deserved.

[richard]

Don't worry Pinza - you could always vote for Nick Clegg...

I don't know if anyone else has read Matthew Engel's "Eleven Minutes Late"(*) but his take on the reason the Major Government privatised the railways is because they had basically run out of policy ideas and had to be seen to be doing something. IIRC the idea was floated during the late 1980s but there was no appetite so it kept getting ignored/postponed. Then when it happened, they rushed it through with very little thought.

The book concentrates on privatisation but also includes a two century history with an interesting take. For example the capitalist robber baron approach (he claims virtually unique to the US and UK) led to a large amount of short term inefficiency and duplication - but this often paid off many decades later - eg. the existence of working relief lines during wartime or with growing traffic.


(*) Yes the title is a Reginald Perrin reference. Eleven minutes late - escaped Puma at Chessington North, etc.