Things I Miss About Railways Today

Flamingo · Post by **Flamingo** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:54 pm

What I miss most of all is spendig days by the lineside near Greenwood Box just south of Hadley South Tunnel. I'm talking early to mid 1950s here. Before they widened the line, I mean.

A grimy New England WD restarting from Greenwood down loop with its train of 60 or 70 coal empties from Ferme Park. Loose coupled wagons of course, to give that lovely clink-clonk-clunk sound right along the length of the train until the whole shebang was on the move. Very nostalgic, nothing like it anywhere nowadays.

Watching the up non-stop (Capitals Limited / Elizabethan) come through. Preferably a day with a Haymarket A4 - 60011 Empire of India was my favourite.

Waiting on the overbridge for the evening York Goods. A 50A V2 with about 600 tons behind the tender pounding up the 1 in 200 at no more than 30 - 35mph. If I close my eyes and turn back time I can still see that tall column of grey-black smoke as she comes through New Barnet, then around the curve towards Greenwood with that pounding beat raising the echoes far and wide. The most thrilling sound in all my years of watching trains. Some times York sent one of its B16s out for this job, it was nice to see one of those but you could tell the difference and it was nothing like the sound of a V2.

Boris · Post by **Boris** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:35 pm

The one I used to love to hear and see was "The Whisky" hauled by a V2 coming up from Tinsley to Darnall especially if it had not stopped at Tinsley for a Banker.
It would be about 4.30 am on a morning, working full regulater and full cut off for the last 2-300 yards of the about 1 in 90 gradient before joining the main line from Sheffield to Darnall station opposite Cravens Works and Darnall loco shed.

I have seen the shed mess room empty on occassions just to watch the fireworks.

giner · Post by **giner** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:04 am

It's great to hear all your stories, guys. As 60041 said, a ride on the footplate was something special. Not easily come by, that's for sure.

My favourite spot was at the buffer end of the platforms at Kings Cross, and my usual ploy was to look appealingly at the driver and announce that my uncle Jim was a fireman. He actually was, and most of the crews, Top Shed ones, anyway, knew him - although there was almost always a distinct look of skepticism in their eyes at my pronouncement.

Anyway, my methods did meet with some success and garnered me many a ride on a Pacific down to the far end of the platform.

Let's hear some more of your adventures.

Boris · Post by **Boris** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:15 am

There was a standard distance between telegraph pole but I was always told 31 rail joints gave the speed in M.P.H.

Thats what most drivers worked on as well as basic quess work

Flamingo · Post by **Flamingo** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:01 pm

Boris wrote:There was a standard distance between telegraph pole but I was always told 31 rail joints gave the speed in M.P.H.

Thats what most drivers worked on as well as basic quess work

Yes the time in seconds over 31 rail joints would usually be pretty close to the speed in m.p.h. The big assumption though is that the rails were standard 60 foot rails. If there were a few 45-footers or even 30-foot lengths in the timing period your result wouldn't be right.

Over the course of time the standard 60 foot track panels tended to suffer from dipped joints at both ends and a foot or two would be lopped off at each end to prolong their life before complete renewal was unavoidable.

About 20 years ago I remember travelling down to Salisbury one evening behind a class 50. It was too dark to time by the quarter mile posts which in any case were on the near side of the train and not that easy to see even in good light. Anyway, our driver on this occasion was renowned for fast running (that's why I and several others were on the train that particular evening) and he did not disappoint us. I would not care to guess how fast we went but as we were running down Porton Bank the frequency of the wheels passing over the rail joints sounded exactly like an HST at cruising speed. If that track was normal 60 foot lengths we must have been very very quick indeed. I suspect there were some short lengths though. When we got to Salisbury where a crew change was due I said to our fast friend "You certainly know how to make these things go". He just grinned.

Cuddie Headrigg · Post by **Cuddie Headrigg** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 7:29 pm

Flamingo wrote:What I miss most of all is spendig days by the lineside near Greenwood Box just south of Hadley South Tunnel. I'm talking early to mid 1950s here. Before they widened the line, I mean.

Can't manage a WD or V2. How about this?
http://steamingback.fotopic.net/p47020525.html

Flamingo · Post by **Flamingo** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:32 pm

Cuddie, you have chosen a great username and I might even have a picture of 62426 somewhere. But Oh dear! I'm a Spurs supporter and you posted a picture of Arsenal.

But yes, that shot was taken very close to where I spent so many happy hours in the 1950s.

Cuddie Headrigg · Post by **Cuddie Headrigg** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:46 pm

Flamingo wrote:Cuddie, you have chosen a great username and I might even have a picture of 62426 somewhere. But Oh dear! I'm a Spurs supporter and you posted a picture of Arsenal.

That's a pity. 2858 "Newcastle United" lasted only 10 days before it was given the name "The Essex Regiment"! We had to endure "Sunderland" for years then again on a Class 66. What not many Sunderland supporters know is that No. 2854 "Sunderland" being rostered on one of the trains for Sunderland's appearence in the 1937 Cup Final was in works at the time, so the nameplates were transferred to No. 2851 "Derby County" and temporarily renumbered on 17th April 1937 at Gorton MPD and kept them till 9th May 1937 when the status quo was resumed.

giner · Post by **giner** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:14 am

Flamingo wrote:What I miss most of all is spendig days by the lineside near Greenwood Box just south of Hadley South Tunnel. I'm talking early to mid 1950s here. Before they widened the line, I mean.

Your comment triggered my recollection that I had torn out a picture from an old calendar and, after some rummaging about, I found it. The picture is of a painting by Terence Cuneo who painted some wonderful railway scenes including this one of "Greenwood Signal Box, New Barnet". Here's the link:

http://www.ssplprints.com/picdetails.ph ... oo=4363om1

You may have well seen it before, but if you haven't I'm sure you'll be delighted with it.

This beautiful location was a little far north in my youth. Oakleigh Park Station was about my limit; until we moved to Stevenage, that is.

Oh, btw, my commiserations to you being a Spurs fan. I'll have to admit to being a lifelong supporter of the lads in red and white down the Seven Sisters Road.

Cuddie Headrigg · Post by **Cuddie Headrigg** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:36 am

giner wrote: This beautiful location was a little far north in my youth. Oakleigh Park Station was about my limit; until we moved to Stevenage, that is.

Got something for you, too. Hope I'm not being annoying. No football link this time, though!

http://steamingback.fotopic.net/p47020522.html

R. pike · Post by **R. pike** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:48 am

I've always wondered why the Greenwood signalman is holding the down goods distant lever when there is a train on the down main. I guess he is just testing his interlocking?

giner · Post by **giner** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:42 am

Cuddie Headrigg wrote:
giner wrote: This beautiful location was a little far north in my youth. Oakleigh Park Station was about my limit; until we moved to Stevenage, that is.
Got something for you, too. Hope I'm not being annoying. No football link this time, though!

http://steamingback.fotopic.net/p47020522.html

Well, thank you sir! The footbridge shrouded in exhaust in the near distance was a great vantage point. It's situated to the south of Oakleigh Park Station a little better than halfway to the north portal of Southgate Tunnel (a lot of norths and souths, there).

I wonder what loco that is just appearing through the smoke on the down slow in the photo? I'm guessing at an N2 on an inner suburban to New Barnet.

Flamingo · Post by **Flamingo** » Tue Mar 18, 2008 10:19 am

[/quote]

Well, thank you sir! The footbridge shrouded in exhaust in the near distance was a great vantage point. It's situated to the south of Oakleigh Park Station a little better than halfway to the north portal of Southgate Tunnel (a lot of norths and souths, there).

I wonder what loco that is just appearing through the smoke on the down slow in the photo? I'm guessing at an N2 on an inner suburban to New Barnet.[/quote]

In my Fotopic collection of pictures from the 50s and 60s there's one of 60017 taken from that very footbridge. Also others from the footbridge at New Southgate:

http://steamontheeastcoastmainline.fotopic.net/

Just the other week I bid (unsuccessfully) on EBay for a photograph of Sir Visto 60068!! no less on a fitted freight near that same spot. The engine looked to be in ex-works condition, probably on a running in turn just after the double chimney was fitted, which puts the date at about April 1959. It would have been a pretty rare sight to find a Carlisle A3 that far south.

Re Cuneo's 'Early Shift' painting, though I was never fortunate enough to be invited into Greenwood Box, in the early days when I first went there the signalmen didn't seem to mind us watching from inside the fence. On one occasion I can even recall being right above the portal of Hadley South tunnel.