The LNER Encyclopedia

The first picture shows a 2P and 5XP heading a Liverpool LS-Hull train at Diggle. The leading coach looks to be a GNR brake third. The second coach with sliding vents on only windows behind the centre door looks to be a semi-open of some sort. The third coach is a first class restaurant car, the next may be a open third but the rest of the Gresley and Thompsons aren't too important at present. I would dearly like to know the diagrams of the first four coaches, if anyone can assist? The next shot is a Liverpool LS-Newcastle at Diggle worked by LMS 5290. The assortment looks to be GNR artic, NER and LNER, all in teak livery. Anyone help here please? Larry G.

Photo A
? (Bill will probably get this quicker than me)
D219 Semi Open First
Dia10 Restaurant (unlike the 10C these have recessed doors) (Isinglass drawing 607)
Dia 165 or 298 Corridor Third end vestibule (Isinglass drawing 121)

Photo B
GNR Brake open third/composite artic twin, probably Diagram 218CC built 1915. Original 8'0 fox bogies have been replaced with Gresley probably 8'6" standard (see Isinglass drawing 141)
End Vestibule Corridor Composite poss D296 built 1939 (Isinglass drawing 101)
After that it is anyone's guess.

Thanks Mike for taking the trouble, I appreciate your help. My D10C diner from MJT sides will have to suffice and at least Bill Bedford lists the earlier semi-open first to D5. Food for thought.

LG

MikeTrice wrote:Photo A
? (Bill will probably get this quicker than me)

GNR D.96 Sheffield stock Brake First

D219 Semi Open First
Dia10 Restaurant (unlike the 10C these have recessed doors) (Isinglass drawing 607)
Dia 165 or 298 Corridor Third end vestibule (Isinglass drawing 121)

I can count only seven windows in this which would make it either a open first or a end vestibule composite. I would have expected this to have been an open third to make up the a three car restaurant set. It is possible that this coach is an early FO which has been down graded to third.

Was this train an Aintree special?

Hi Bill, Jim simply wrote on the back of the photo 'Liverpool Lime Street-Hull with no date. Had it been a special I'm sure he would have mentioned it in the caption. Knowing the position of the sun this was a mid to late afternoon working approaching Diggle. It could be returning from Aintree of course but wouldnt such specials work on the L&Y route over the Summit?

Bill Bedford wrote:I can count only seven windows in this which would make it either a open first or a end vestibule composite.

I assume you are referring to the fourth coach that I have suggested is the corridor third end vestibule?
It appears to be door, toilet, window * 7, toilet, door which would correspond to the compartment side of a corridor third. The vehicle has too many vents to be an open. Too be honest difficult to tell from the photo. Perhaps Coach can tell from the original photograph.

Having looked at the above close up and the original photo, I would say that with just seven window bays it is a corridor third (D155?). It certainly looks like my model to this diagram.

coachmann wrote:Hi Bill, Jim simply wrote on the back of the photo 'Liverpool Lime Street-Hull with no date. Had it been a special I'm sure he would have mentioned it in the caption. Knowing the position of the sun this was a mid to late afternoon working approaching Diggle. It could be returning from Aintree of course but wouldnt such specials work on the L&Y route over the Summit?

I think there were so many specials that day that they used any route that had paths.
Looking at the vegetation, it is perhaps much later in the year.

MikeTrice wrote:Dia 165 or 298 Corridor Third end vestibule (Isinglass drawing 121)

Coach, you are correct, that should read Dia 155 or 298. That will teach me not to cross check the Isinglass drawing where the lettering is indistinct and could be read as either. I chose the wrong interpretation. Apologies.