The LNER Encyclopedia

Hi All
Im currently building a new layout which is being based on the Great Central section in the mid 50's just on the outskirts of Sheffield based loosely on Woodhouse ( which is where I was born and brought up) Can anyone tell me what the length of the platforms at Woodhouse were/are as Ive bought the Metcalfe Country Station Kit ( I know its not an actual reproduction of the buildings at Woodhouse but its near enough) and I want to build the platforms to scale length. I still use the station regularly and it looks about 5 coach lengths to me. Would that be about right?

If you go to maps.google.co.uk you can search for Woodhouse, then select satellite. The resultant image can be zoomed to quite a high resolution and you should have no problem estimating dimensions of the station and platforms.

HTH
Simon.

The Metcalfe kit certainly captures the look of the station buildings, and as part of a full range you can at least blend it in to other layout buildings effectivley!

I always recommend getting hold of the historic OS mapping. 1:2500 [25'' to 1mile] for anywhere you fancy modelling. The 1:2500 shows full track layouts (and all that jazz) and there ought to be an early post WWII edition which would sort you out. Contact either the local studies section of Sheffield library, or the Archives at http://www.sheffield.gov.uk/libraries/a ... contact-us. They may even be able to photocopy it and post it to you.

As one of the 'Derbyshire Extension' stations, Subrit includes it in their list of closed GCR extension buildings- http://www.subbrit.org.uk/sb-sites/stat ... ndex.shtml

should be a cool model- but I bet you'll be suprised when you see just how long a real station is when scaled out to 4mm scale!

Will

I seem to remember reading that the platform lengths of a station were normally 2 - 5 times the length of an 'average' train using the station. Whether that was a sensible comment I am not sure, but from the perspective of someone who has been on a footplate (in preservation) then I fully appreciate the desirability of having some margin for error in judging stopping distances...

That might sound depressingly casual, but when you have several coaches behind you, possibly on wet and greasy rails and on a black, wet night and using 'iffy' coal, even the best driver with control skills comparable to Michael Schumacher in a Ferrari (or Mercedes, but that's another post!) would have difficulty in judging stopping to within a few feet.

(If you've DCC and have programmed your locos with some inertia, you'll get an idea of what judgement is involved).

I have just built the [re-released] station as part of a diorama, any queries, I may be able to help. This is a snapshot of it before adding the final details. Apologies for the rough edges, but I didn't want to inflict my wallpaper and curtains on you...

excellent picture Autocar. May i ask is the signal box a kit or scratch built.

The box is Metcalfe's, as is the Goods shed and cobbled station approach and yard. Accessories include Modelscene, Peco, Langley and Tiny Signs.

This is my second box, the first was fitted with a Wills interior and saw 'service' at a few exhibitions as a display piece.

Nibelungen wrote:Hi All
Im currently building a new layout which is being based on the Great Central section in the mid 50's just on the outskirts of Sheffield based loosely on Woodhouse ( which is where I was born and brought up) Can anyone tell me what the length of the platforms at Woodhouse were/are as Ive bought the Metcalfe Country Station Kit ( I know its not an actual reproduction of the buildings at Woodhouse but its near enough) and I want to build the platforms to scale length. I still use the station regularly and it looks about 5 coach lengths to me. Would that be about right?

I hope this is still of use in apparently helping with your original post.
I have been able to peek at an unamended copy of the Sectional Appendix Suppl't No.1 pages dated 02/02/08, wherein the date-printed 03/03/07 section "OPERATIONAL STATION PLATFORM LENGTHS IN METRES" quotes 84 metres for both Woodhouse platforms (=275.6 feet). I personally know nothing of Woodhouse, but this dimension should represent the length of platform operationally available for use by passenger trains.
So it would be 4-5 coaches in length, depending on what length vehicles are in mind.

Marvellous Thats about what I thought from when Ive had to spend time waiting for the late running SO 16-10 to Cleethorpes oh for the days when it was Mark ones loco hauled instead of a 153 ( though when I was working the Cleethorpes via Brigg Trains in the early 90's it was more often than not a Class 141) Btw The Attached picture is superb and the Signal Box looks like a GC Box not the LNWR one that Metcalfe sell

I seem to remember reading that the platform lengths of a station were normally 2 - 5 times the length of an 'average' train using the station.

During time working on LNW electrification and other services around Leeds.
I seem to remember that most new platforms were built at 100m in length.
Which with a 23m long 4 car unit would give 2 metres per car leeway in stopping point.

Thankfully modern technology has allowed drivers to be more precise these days. In any event, the Class 333 EMUs that predominate on the Airedale and Wharfedale lines tend to brake early for station stops and then coast in at a relatively low speed before braking relatively abruptly for the final application. I am told this is due to the type of brakes used, whatever the explanation, I know one driver who can stop within six inches of the same spot each time at every station - I bet there's few steam drivers who could/can manage that on scheduled services.

As to the 2-5 times length, it does seem a bit expensive/wasteful of resources to me, but if I remember correctly, the comment was made by the late Cyril Freezer, so I figured he'd looked into this and was commenting from a position of some knowledge. Certainly some new stations, built in the last 20 years - such as Frizinghall, Saltaire, Burley Park - have been built with very little room for error/extra capacity. But then these days, as well as drivers having better brakes, guards have electronic control of doors. Maybe CF's comment came from 50+ years ago when different rules and regulations applied?

Regarding what an earlier poster said about using Google Earth to "estimate" platform lengths, you don't have to - there is a Ruler available on the toolbar.Simply select it and your required units of measurement.

Just had another thought, if you look in the Quail map series books, then most national network stations have platform lengths given as part of the information. I can't remember whether they are quoted in chains or coach lengths (what coach?!) but it should give an indication...

Autocar Publicity wrote: .... " As to the 2-5 times length, it does seem a bit expensive/wasteful of resources to me, but if I remember correctly, the comment was made by the late Cyril Freezer, so I figured he'd looked into this and was commenting from a position of some knowledge. Certainly some new stations, built in the last 20 years - such as Frizinghall, Saltaire, Burley Park - have been built with very little room for error/extra capacity. But then these days, as well as drivers having better brakes, guards have electronic control of doors. " ....

Although Mr. Freezer is a well-known name to me, I'm not familiar with the extent/areas of his writings, so I'm just wondering whether the 2-5 statistic might have been the yardstick of only one particular area or pre-nat'n company.

On control of doors, traincrew release/opening controls on many classes and types of stock is only 'all or nothing'. To prevent only some end-of-train doors from opening in the event of slight platform overrun (or even planned calling at a platform too short for all doors to be safely usable), a train needs to have SDO (Selective Door Opening), a facility also familiar to many users of certain London Underground stock at a few particular station platforms for very many years [The A stock (Metropolitan 'main line'), which has this, must be up to about 48 years old now; quite a feat of longevity in intensive use!]