The LNER Encyclopedia

HI ,has any one got any information on the formation of sleeping trains especially from kingscross,have tried trainformations but have drawn a blank

For what period - I think I can remember typical formations of the 60s, if that would help ?

Thanks but Im looking for 1923 to1948 Have tried several books but they dont give the formation only the discription of the carriages

The Northern Belle was an all first class sleeper for 60 passengers and carried 30 staff. It was made up of the artic first class sleepers with the triplet set when not in use by the flying Scotsman and day coaches (first class open), as it was away for about a week. Plus space for the staff to sleep.

CVR1865 wrote:The Northern Belle was an all first class sleeper for 60 passengers and carried 30 staff. It was made up of the artic first class sleepers with the triplet set when not in use by the flying Scotsman and day coaches (first class open), as it was away for about a week. Plus space for the staff to sleep.

The Northern Belle was not a true sleeper train as it was a cruise train for people to have there holiday leaving London and then traverling mainly around Scotland.

I know but what a journey.

Have you got LNER Carriages by Michael Harris as on page 93 gives train formation for summer 1935 for 6 trains.

Hi for the info the northern belle sounds like an interesting project and |Ill see if I can find the book on ebay

Chainsaw: re: Northern Belle ,the Gresley Observer, house magazine of the Gresley Society, has in recent issues published a series of very comprehensive and well researched articles on the Northern Belle. Well worth reading if you are interested.

Re: Northern Belle:

There is a good article on the Northern Belle at:
http://mikes.railhistory.railfan.net/r084.html
Also, to wet your whistle here is a photo of said train.
Malcolm

Another Northern Belle photo.

Malcolm

Although the caption describes those in the picture as villagers, I suspect they are the lucky passengers of the Belle. If you can get hold of back issues of the Gresley Observer, there are some fascinating and highly detailed accounts of the various tours, which were incredibly complex to organise from a railway operator's point of view. Look at the photo again and let's hope the character weighed down with binoculars (?) on the left of the buffer beam doesn't sneeze - or he will be on the ballast!

Returning to the OP, I understand that in recent times the (diesel) Glasgow-Fort William portion of the London sleeper comprised two sleepers and two ordinary MK2s.

Was there a similar formation/service in LNER/British Railways steam days?

According to a 1953 edition of CJ Allen's Titled Trains of Gt Britain, by 1938/9 the winter Ft William portion of the Aberdonian left KX at 7:30 pm and consisted of a compo sleeping car plus a compo brake and was due into Ft William at 09:46. In summer 1939 they were conveyed on the7:25 pm Highlandman. The portion came off at Waverley, he says, and left for Queen St at 4:30 am to be attached there to the 5:50 am service to Mallaig.
Coming back departure from Ft William was 4:07 pm and came forward from Queen St at 10:00 pm and into KX at 7:25 am. This through service was withdrawn during WW2 but had been restored, with similar timings, when the book was published. Certainly similar workings were in force in the mid to late 60s until all the Anglo Scottish sleeper services were concentrated on Euston by the late 70s. Incidentally, it seems a great shame that nobody has yet written a book celebrating sleeping car services in this country, there were some obscure ones, even in diesel days, such as Inverness - Edinburgh, KX- Leeds and Bristol - Glasgow to say nothing of the summer Motorail services that conveyed sleepers. All gone, unfortunately.

Most kind Sir

Thankyou