Jan 2nd 1982. End of the Deltic era!

[Mickey]

Sorry to deviate from the main topic thread.

Yes Hatfield Shed i remember being on that bridge a couple of times back in the early 1970s it had a sandy track/path running across it and from memory the sides of the brick built bridge were built fairly low to just above waist height if i remember correctly but you did have a good view of the approaching trains in either direction. The view northwards towards Welwyn Garden City station had the embankment rising along the left side of the railway line and was dominated by the tall brick arches of the 20th Mile bridge in the distance and the view to the south towards London was a lot more open with fields either side of the railway line which ran straight for some distance before curving off to the left in the far distance towards Hatfield.

At onetime there was 6 running lines along this length of the GN main line between Hatfield & Welwyn Garden City.

The Welwyn Garden City railway accident of 1957 happened in the immediate area of the Sand hole bridge as well.


Mickey

[Hermit 109]

I remember the Deltic era with great affection. I was lucky enough to be at Top Shed at the end of steam and during the transition to diesel power, so I had the privilege of a few mainline firing turns on A4's, A3's V2's, and a few others, but the majority of my career at King's Cross was on Diesels of which Deltics played a large part.
I was lucky to have seven years in the three main line links and also lucky in having regular drivers with whom I shared the driving duties 50/50. That meant on turns to York, Doncaster, Leeds etc; I would drive down one day and my mate drive up and we would alternate the following day. But on lodging turns to Newcastle we would swop over at Tuxford and my mate always insisted I did the Northern end of the run to Newcastle as it was the best way to learn the road intimately.
So my Deltic experiences started in 1962 when the locos were purely vacuum brake fitted and sound deadening screens hadn't been fitted, right up to the end of 1973 when I passed for driving and dropped back to the bottom links. That experience covered all 22 loco's and many thousand of miles on each one, 50% of which was in the driving seat. I consider myself very lucky to have experienced such an iconic locomotive in it's heyday, and have many fond recollections and thankfully kept a log of each run to aid memories in old age !!

[sandwhich]

One other thing I remember about the Deltic era was the high mileage of these locos, there was one that worked the 0800 from the Cross to Edinburgh fuelled and serviced for a return to the Cross with an arrival about 2200 nearly 800 miles quite something for those days, another one was a Leeds to KX again fuelled and serviced before working the 1200 right through to Aberdeen, and a similar working in the Up direction. I think it was safe to say that in 22 years of operation they certainly got their moneys worth out of them.

[Mickey]

There use to be a couple of overnight sleepers that were Deltic hauled i remember that came Up road from Aberdeen during the night back in the late 1960s & early 1970s, i think they may have left Aberdeen around 21:15 & 21:45 respectively the night before and use to pass through Welwyn Garden City the next morning around 06:20 & 06:40 or there abouts, both trains were usually fairly long trains with about 14 & 15 vehicles on behind the loco including 7 or 8 sleeping cars with 2 or 3 B.R.Mk1 composites mixed in with a couple of B.R.Mk1 BGs and a couple of GUVs bringing up the rear, in the early morning light they looked quite an impressive sight as they rumbled passed at a stately 50 mph with there steam heating trailing along the entire length of the train on there way Up to Kings Cross.

Occasionally a Brush type 4 may have been on the front but usually they were Deltics.

I presume they may have stopped at Edinburgh, Newcastle & York on there way Up to Kings Cross.

After reading your post Andy i reckon your correct about the departure times from Aberdeen for the overnight sleeper trains for Kings Cross and was probably earlier than what i posted especially the 21:45 time that does seems a bit late on reflection and was probably nearer between 20:00-2100 (8:00-9:00pm) rather than as late as 21:45 as i posted.

Mickey

[Andy W]

In my era at the Cross (mid to late 70's), the up overnight Aberdeens were the 1925, 2015 and 2115, all Deltic hauled from Edinburgh and the locos went onto work the 0900, 1100 and 1000 Down respectively. The last up one was the Night Aberdonian.

I thought the 1977 diagram that started with the 0800 Up from Edinburgh was a great one. It had come off the 2215 in the early hours and after reaching the Cross went back on the 1600 Down. It then took over the 1925 (from Aberdeen) at Edinburgh, arriving at the Cross at about half six, after doing nearly 1200 miles in less than 24 hours.

The 0800 down was similarly balanced on the 1600 Up and then quickly turned round for the 0115 Leeds and 0730 return.

Deltics were at their best when kept hot and on trains that didn't have too many stops.

[sandwhich]

Come to think of it there were not many Deltics standing around except at weekends, they were kept on the move alright, occasionally they would be used on the Cambridge line for running in turns after attention at Clarence Yard and on one occasion one was used on a local run from Welwyn Garden City to Kings Cross with a fitter on board no doubt again after depot attention.

[Hermit 109]

Kings Cross duty 152 in the early 70's worked down to Newcastle with the 07.45 1N06 and returned from Newcastle with 01.02 1E40 the next day arrived at Kings Cross at 05.51. Both trains booked class 55. Not sure where 1E40 originated other than Scotland

Kings Cross duty 159 in the same period worked down to Newcastle with 23.15 1S77 (Night Aberdonian) and returned next day with 17.00 1A32 arrival at Kings Cross 20.35. Both trains booked class 55. The 23.15 1S77 normally departed from the old platform 6 and the loco would be standing under the box with 13 on waiting departure. In the return journey 1A32 was a fast business train with only 8 on, early arrivals in London were not unusual, The Deltics were masters of their job regardless of the weight behind them.

[Hermit 109]

Here's an interesting picture taken from a Deltic at Offord at the time when the River Great Ouse was being diverted to allow the curves to be eased and the old 70mph speed restriction to be lifted

[Hermit 109]

Whoop ! Looks like picture didn't attach, back to the drawing board. Looks like file size is too big, will have another go later

[Hermit 109]

No date or loco ID

[Mickey]

The 'Offord curves' next to the river Ouse, that Offord s/box was a nice looking box i always thought.

The early 1970s weekdays and 1E01 was always Deltic hauled and use to pass Welwyn Garden City sometime between 13:30-14:00 that was in turn followed about an hour or so later by 1E05 again another Deltic hauled Up express that use to come Up road around 15:00hrs i think?.

I wish i had kept the WGC box simplifiers (i may have even wrote them out when i was at the box?) it had all the train movements 24/7 at WGC that included passenger & freight headcodes, passing times, terminating & departure times writen on it for 1972-73 & 1973-74 i could have posted it.

Mickey

[Dave Cockle]

My favourite Deltic memory was when I was a signalman at Wood Green No 4 in 1972. We used to have an ECS train off Bounds Green at 16:05 booked to run Fast Line from Wood Green and form the 17:18 KX - Cambridge. The ECS was booked for Deltic haulage as once the 17:18 departed from KX the Deltic would be shunted from the buffer stops onto the North end of a main line train. The Deltic would have been stationary for some time, coupled onto the coaches in Bounds Green CS, with the engine running. This causes a build up of oily deposits in the exhaust system. The ECS train used to come slowly through the Up Branch Platform at Wood Green (15mph) then snake across the point work out onto the Up Fast. At this point the driver would open up the controller fully and all the running line South of Wood Green would become enveloped with white exhaust fumes temporarily creating limited visibility. The clag lingered for up to a minute as the train accelerated away and all the Wood Green signalman could see was the tail lamp on the last coach disappearing into the swirling white clag. A great audio visual display which I remember clearly over forty years later.

[Mickey]

Yeah good one Dave.

My own eternal memory of a 'similar happening' which i did post once before a few years ago happened one Saturday afternoon at Kings Cross in about 1971 or 1972.

It was usual back then on a Saturday sometime between 2:00-2:30pm in the afternoon to perform a regular shunt move to release a Deltic off the front end of the Up express that it had brought into platform no.5 this was done by 'unhooking' the Deltic from the train and the Deltic then drawing forward a bit onto the hydraulic buffers (but not touching them) and at about the sametime the ECS was drawn forward by 1-SHUNT loco (0S01 usually a Brush class 31 performed that duty) on a shunt S-signal at the 'top end' end of the platforms were it would stop with about 2 coach lengths at the rear of the train clear of the crossover points between platforms nos.5 & 6. Then to release the loco this was achieved by the shunter on the ground operating a x2 lever ground frame that reversed the crossover points between both platform roads nos.5 & 6 and with the crossover reversed by the shunter the loco would then travel back along the adjacent unoccupied platform no.6 road all the way to the other end of the station (the top end) where it would eventually make it's way over to the Passenger Loco for re-fueling.

Anyway on that particular Saturday afternoon there was a clear view of this movement happening because on that afternoon no trains were in either platforms nos. 7 or 8 so once the Deltic had been released and had started it's travel back through the crossover and then along the unoccupied platform no.6 road the driver 'opened her up' on the controller and the Deltic threw out tons of white/blue exhaust fumes that without exaggeration covered the whole of the 'buffer stops end' of the station all the way up passed the old footbridge in a 'fog' of white/blue diesel fumes smoke high into the roof of the station as well as covering the station at platform level as well for about 5 or 6 minutes before it eventually dispersed to the total amazement of many member's of the public on the station!!.

I can still remember the driver a west indian bloke as he arrived at the 'top end' of the platform at the signal(s) looking back from the open cab window of the Deltic and laughing!!.

Mickey

[Dave Cockle]

Nice story Micky. I wonder if the driver could have been the late Joe Gunter? He was always cheerful and bursting out into laughter. He finished up his days visiting schools and giving safety talks.

[StevieG]

Seems like an appropriate moment to follow on with a repeat of an April 12th post of mine from 2009 in the "Memories" thread in the "Railway Chat" forum : -

" .... one late 1960s(/early '70s) morning (a Sat. I think, but I suppose that's irrelevant), when at Goods & Mineral signal box (the one that governed the ins and outs of King's Cross Goods Yard), a Deltic emerged from Gasworks Tunnel working hard pulling a down express steadily through 'Belle Isle' before plunging into Copenhagen Tunnel; whilst visible through Belle Isle, the driver was using a method of driving which seemed to consist of about 7 seconds full power on, 5 secs. power off, 7 on, 5 off, etc., etc..
But the Deltic's exhaust was constantly really thick and white, such that holding up a hand and forearm horizontally to obscure sight of the loco allowed one to imagine a Gresley Pacific or such was pulling the train.

This was just as a 350hp (Cl. 08) shunter was being signalled from the 'North Yard' (Nos. 3-8 Arch Sidings) with some wagons, merely to make a shunt out towards the Down Goods to go back in, 'Under the Wall' (Nos. 10-12 Arch Sdgs.; under the inclined viaduct leading from No.9 Arch to up above Cop.Tnl. en route to the Caledonian Coal Yard) - ; - or vice versa.
Now G&M was a very tall box, and the north end of No.99 points which this shunt had to pass clear of so that they could be reversed for the move to come back over, were right outside the box.

As the express disappeared into Copenhagen tunnel, the thick, white exhaust drifted slowly north-westwards and engulfed the 'throat' of 'the goods yard'.
So thick was it that G&M's No.99s, and the shunt itself, were (unbelievably) temporarily invisible from the box window above, and we had to resort to listening from the open window for the creaks and groans of the slowing shunt's open 'Low', 'Med', or whatever wagons to hear the whereabouts of the last one to know when it had cleared the points, and so that they could then be moved and the 'dollies' pulled off for the shunt to set back. "