Atlantic's works: Portable layout - Ground Signals Again

[45609]

Mick B for instance has found different results to mine when trying to find a matching shade to the Hornby LNER green, so maybe it varies from model to model?

That sounds to be a bit of a pain. I want to restore one side of an A3 tender where I was a little over zealous with removing the "L N E R" without having to do a full repaint. Can one of you point me in the direction of this info please? Assuming it has been posted and was not an offline discussion.

Thanks....Morgan

[mick b]

If you mean the colour I use Precision Doncaster Green

[2002EarlMarischal]

That sounds to be a bit of a pain. I want to restore one side of an A3 tender where I was a little over zealous with removing the "L N E R" without having to do a full repaint. Can one of you point me in the direction of this info please? Assuming it has been posted and was not an offline discussion.

I'd like to jump on the back of Morgan's query too please.

Here are 2 photos of the GN tender formerly behind the model of Great Northern that I have changed to Empire Ex 4472. It started out with small letters "L N E R" and large 1470N. I wanted to use it behind a later model and replace these with the usual large "L N E R".

In the first pic, you can see the side of the tender where I tried Graeme's technique of using a sharp blade to gently scratch the numbers and letters off. I was not careful enough, as reported in my own thread, and as a consequence I masked off the panel within the lining and sprayed it out, then lettered it again.

In the second pic, this is the re-lettered side having used the T-Cut method. I believe that you can see the shiny surface and the ghost of the old lettering.

I know I need to apply varnish now - I just need some convincing that I can get a good enough finish to put the tender behind one of the RTR locos (and free up a corridor tender for my grey Woodcock project).

Apologies if this is in any way hijacking Graeme's thread!

[mick b]

I use aerosol Games Workshop Satin Varnish warmed first in hot not boiling water. Aleways test on a small area first as not all paints react well to it. Never had a problem on Hornby finish. Any doubts I seal the paint first with Vallejo Acrlic gloss varnish. I always do this with Precision paint as very senstive to other types of paint/varnish.


In the first picture you have a lot of silvering on at least one letter use Microsol on all of the lettering this should make it lie "flat" always apply decals on a gloss shiny surface for best results.

[2002EarlMarischal]

Thanks Mick B!

Obviously Games Workshop Satin Varnish is going to be available anywhere they sell that range. Do you have a recommended supplier for Vallejo Acrylic gloss varnish and Microsol?

[mick b]

E bay or art shops.

There are a few sites on a goggle search none obvious that stock both products however

[Atlantic 3279]

My observations have been that my samples of both Precision Doncaster Green, and Railmatch Doncaster Green, whether finished gloss, satin of matt, looked noticeably "browner" than the "LNER green" on either of the two Hornby super-detail loco-driven A1 Flying Fox models that I bought. That particular version of Hornby LNER green looked more convincing to me than the "eighties" version that adorns my B17 and D49, which is perhaps darker and even more pea-green. Now I did at one stage manage to match that older green, near enough, with a blend of Railmatch Donny and Darlington greens, though I've no idea if that could be done for the Flying Fox shade.
Could it even be that Precison paint varies from batch to batch, so that Mick's paint and mine are not the same, notwithstanding the the fact that it is said to be manufactured to high standards using the original colour specification? I make no accusation or slur here, I merely ask the question.

[60800]

Could it even be that Precison paint varies from batch to batch, so that Mick's paint and mine are not the same, notwithstanding the the fact that it is said to be manufactured to high standards using the original colour specification? I make no accusation or slur here, I merely ask the question.

I wouldn't be too surprised if that were the case. I've never had two pots of any humbrol paint that are exactly the same shade.

[Atlantic 3279]

Back to the saga of the A1/1. After an unreasonable amount of fiddling around with highly breakable plastic parts, and trying out unsuccessful ideas, it now has brake gear that acts on the front of the wheels and I know how, in future, to swap things over much more quickly and easily. I've also managed to correct the backwards and insufficient offset of the Walschaerts return crank on the right of the chassis, without in the process wrecking anything or (I believe) making the motion either prone to coming adrift spontaneously or (at the opposite extreme) virtually impossible to dismantle. At a glance the loco has hardly changed, so some might consider that the changes that consumed so much effort could really be omitted without fatally marring the final model. It's all up to individual tastes and "standards":

I'll show in more detail how I did these jobs and catch up on the details of how I made the Comet motion bracket fit, in due course, but for the moment I'm heading for some relaxation....

[Horsetan]

I wonder if anyone from Hornby is watching this, and making plans for their next RTR model?

[S.A.C. Martin]

I sincerely hope not - purely on the basis of Graeme's sweet handiwork!

It's an interesting one though. Only one engine, but I think, a lot of liveries...?

1. LNER (Wartime) Prussian Blue - 4470
2. LNER Apple Green - 4470
3. LNER Apple Green - 113
4. BR Branded Apple Green - 60113
5. BR Express Passenger Blue - 60113
6. BR Dark Green, Cycling Lion - 60113
7. BR Dark Green, Ferret & Dartboard - 60113

One could argue you could also have 5a and 5b where the nameplate was exchanged for a crested version before a repaint into the dark green.

[Atlantic 3279]

Setting up the Motion Bracket

Whilst the outer parts of the Comet V2 motion bracket were "near enough" in terms of shape, dimensions and hole positions as compared to the Isinglass drwg. it was obvious that the broad flat stretcher could not be used as supplied. I needed a shaped stretcher that would be slim enough to engage in the slot across the top of the Hornby chassis, with its ends bent upwards in such a way that they would reach around the "trough" between the recessed splashers under the body and gain enough height to hold the visible parts of the bracket tightly up against the egdes of the running plate. Given that I couldn't hope to get it all correct in one go by basic measurement and "dead-reckoning", and really needed to preserve the ability to adjust the bracket fore/aft and up/down until everything was spot-on, it seemed best to me to initially make a separate stretcher that could later be united with the outer ends once these were just were I wanted them to be.
Having made up the basics of the bracket, a quick look at it held against the chassis confirmed that the etched hole for screw mounting would be too small and in the wrong place. In order to have plenty of room for access to a new screw hole in an added layer of metal, I cut away a chunk of the original stretcher thus:

I then made up a separate stretcher in 20 thou brass to fit the slot in the chassis, giving this the upturned ends that were necessary. With this loosely fitted against the underside of the Comet item I was able to position these pieces on the chassis, adjust the bends in the stretcher to set the height, and shuffle the relative positions fore and aft until I was happy. Having noted or marked the relationship as best I could, I then removed the pieces from the chassis and soldered them together on the bench where access was good and there was no risk to the rest of the loco.

I'll continue later as time is against me at present.....

[Atlantic 3279]

Once the new stretcher was soldered in place I could cut out the remains of the old one and file the top faces of the slopes/angles to try to avoid any interference with the fit of the body:

In fact. as I mentioned some way back, I had to cut away the plating that I had added between the residual splashers in the area directly above the motion bracket, leaving the stretcher itself to close of the gap, as the top of the area of chassis on which the bracket sits is in fact at the same level as the lower faces of the plating that I had added to the body - i.e. there is no room for even the 20 thou thickness of the bracket to pass between the two unless yet more bends are introduced to the stretcher (and any downward bends to miss the bodywork would bring the stretcher closer to fouling the tops of the coupled wheels).

[Atlantic 3279]

Here's how the stretcher fits on the chassis, before screwing the DCC socket and its base back into place.

The position of the sides of the bracket that best agreed with drawings, and which still made it appear possible for the weighshaft to sneak past the flanges of the middle driving wheels, did not match up with the rear ends of the slidebars. Fortunately, it was easy to push the slidebars further into the cylinder (further improving agreement with the drawing) without running into any trouble with the crosshead at either end of its stroke.

I completed the valve gear on the following basis:

Expansion links and lifting levers for reversing - Comet V2, as supplied,
Radius Rod - Hornby rod cut off to length at rear end, split from slidebars, and drilled at the right position to fit the Comet expansion link. (I might have been able to use the Comet rad rod, but it looked as if it might prove just a touch short so I decided that drilling a new hole in the Hornby one and saving myself the job of splitting and remaking the joint at the top of the combination lever was the easiest plan.
Eccentric Rod - cut-and-shut shortened Hornby rod, the Comet one being too short.

[Atlantic 3279]

Correcting the Return Crank

The crank on the right of the loco leant the wrong way and didin't impart enough movement to the expansion link. It would satisfy some, but I was curious to see what, if anything, could be done to correct it.
The Hornby driving crankpin projects through the big end of the conrod, and then the final part of its length (half a mil or less) is of reduced diameter, so that there's effectively a rebate round the edge of the end of the pin. The sides of the slimmer projecting end piece have flats on opposite faces, instead of it being fully circular. These flats match flats on the sides of the hole in the return crank and determine its "lean". Once the crank is on the pin, with flats engaged, a hex-head screw keeps the lot in place.

In order to re-set the "lean" of the crank, I filed out its centre hole to a true circle, eliminating the flats, then also filed the plating off the inside face of the crank and tinned that face. To create room for a solder-proof paper spacer in the assembly, I temporarily took the con-rod off the crank pin and recovered the spacer ring that fits over the pin inboard of the con-rod. I filed the ring down a little in width so that the con-rod could sit slightly further inboard than previously - still with no danger of it catching other crankpins and so on. I then also carefully tinned JUST THE REBATE around the end of the crankpin. I then put the spacer ring and the con-rod back over the crankpin (coupling rods also still in place of course) plus a tight fitting paper washer outboard of the con-rod big-end. Over this I pressed the return crank into position, orientated as I wanted it, then briefly sweated it onto the pin using the hot soldering iron. I had to jam the end of a small file into place behind the wheel whilst doing this, so as to keep the crankpin pushed "outwards" - otherwise the pressure and heat on its outer end just make the crankpin retreat into the wheel! Once the crank was soldered lightly in place, locking its orientation, I also refitted the hex-head screw to mechanically support the crankpin in its new orientation, and then tore out the paper washer.
It is not possible to simply twist the crankpin in the wheel to alter the lean of the crank - the pin orientation is keyed in the wheel moulding.