The LNER Encyclopedia

G'Day Gents
I've got a question, the N2 tanks had to be fitted with condensing gear to work over the Met, but the J52's and later J50's did not, all three class's work over the same tracks to Farringdon St,so why the difference??
manna

You know it's summer in South Australia when you burn your hand on the gear knob

You are only half right Manna. Some J52s were fitted with condensers, although the fittings were not as obvious as on an N2. Two short pipes emerged from the sides of the smokebox and curved round into the front of the tanks. There was also an extra, parallel-sided dome on top of the front of the tank. As far as I'm aware no J50 was ever fitted with condenser gear but, as noted elsewhere in forum they only arrived in London post-war - maybe the LPTB never noticed!

Chaz

G'Day Gents
Thanks for that Chaz, strange how they were very strict on the passenger side but when it came to freight, also while we're here, did small tender engines (ie J3's) ever go down the met??
manna

manna wrote:G'Day Gents
Thanks for that Chaz, strange how they were very strict on the passenger side but when it came to freight, also while we're here, did small tender engines (ie J3's) ever go down the met??
manna

Never heard of tender engines going down there but that's not to say it didn't happen. Remember that tripcock testing device on the offside of the platform at York Road? I got the distinct impression that not all trains (diesel days certainly) had the equipment working when they went down onto the LT system. How I wish the years could be rolled back - never mind, Manna, it's about 3c tonight and thawing!

G'Day Gents
Yes I do remember the trip cock tester at York Rd, every time we arrived at York Rd I had to get out of the cab and put the trip cock down, but only once did I ever pull the lever down to make the trip cock live, the only time I did do it we came to a grinding halt 50' inside the tunnel, I then had to squeeze out of the cab to reset the whole lot, not easy when you've only got a foot of room, pitch black and being deafened by a class 31 engine only a few feet away and your trying to do it all by feel?? and the fumes are build up as well, never did that again!! I have a recollection that a A3 was signalled to go down there once???
Sorry to hear that the snow's going, your going to miss that,cooled down a bit here to only 26c
manna


You know it's summer in Australia when you see a car in Alice Springs with a surf board on the roof

Don't forget the N1's, I imagine that in their lives they ran more miles through the Widened Lines than the N2's.
The N1's preceded the N2's and they had the twin condenser pipe arrangement, subsequently used on the N2's.
N1's were used on the Hither Green and Feltham freight services. They were not fitted with LPTB trip gear - if they had been the drivers would not have used it. Just imagine if the engine was accidentally tripped by a lump of coal or whatever as the train was being accelerated for the run under the Grid-iron and up into Farringdon Station, that'd test the couplings!!(and the Guard).

.The J52's used on the Battersea,Herne Hill,Bricklayers Arms, Brockley services were the old Stirling ones, given domed boilers by Gresley.
At Hornsey these were known to all as "Starvers".
The Ivatt J 52's were known as "North Londons" Some really old hands knew them as "Domers". They never went over the Widened Lines.
Our Starvers were fitted with a single pipe condenser, the operating gear being very securely spragged to make sure that it was not used. The operating handle was over the driver's side and following normal practice was not marked in any way. Heaven help the uninitiated!

Over on the GE I once witnessed the down side of this. A starver, straight out of Stratford Works, was under the pump at Park Yard and after filling went to move off. There was a frightening bang
and clatter, steam and water in all directions, and the filler lid flew off.
Presumably the crew had mistaken the condenser handle for the cocks, directing the exhaust steam into a brim full tank.

G'Day Gents
Thanks lead-plug I'd fogotten about the N1's, they were around for a long time, mind you you do'nt see many pictures them around KX, then there is also the C12's, but they did go a long time ago, would loved to have seen one of Ivatts R1 0-8-2's going down the hole at York Rd
manna

That's a thought manna, eight-coupled into Moorgate, I'll bet that the long wheel-base caused some grief to the track in the York Rd. and Hotel Curve tunnels.
What a fearsome sight it must have made on a foggy night in the evening rush hour as one of these monsters came up from the depths.
Incidentally, I'm now wondering why such a heavy loco was required,
in view of the restrictions on train (and loco) length imposed by Moorgate platform length.
To revert to the N1's: Top shed used to have a number of these, they ran a number of trains to Feltham with them as well as providing the Snow Hill Banker.
At Hornsey we knew the N1's as "Small Mets", the N2's being "Big Mets". We graduates from the Ian Allen ABC school had to learn all of the nicknames quickly - shed setting in the blackout brought engine identification problems never mentioned in the books that I had read!
Anyway, it seemed that met engines had always been referred to in this way. The C 12's were at one time Big Mets, then the N1's got the title, then along came the N2's to collar the honour!
When I was at Hornsey the C12 had dropped back to "Hornsey carriage sidings stationary boiler"

Do you know if the N's at Top Shed went through the same 'naming' routine?

G'Day Gents
Sorry a bit before my time, I did'nt start a KX until Oct 1970, they'd all gone by then, mores the pity.
I think the R1's were designed more for acceleration than anything else, but there were to heavy, I think they ended up at Colwick, on coal trains??
manna

This thread has caused me to chase the spiders out of the bookcase (no redbacks) and look up R.A.H. Weight, who tables a couple of Avonside 8 coupled condensing tanks introduced by Sturrock and introduced in 1866. It would seem that even as early as this there existed a need for something better than the 4 coupled engines that served until the N 1's.
I'm thinking passenger again. When did Farringdon Goods Depot open? The bigguns would have been useful for freight into there. They wouldn't have been allowed to Blackfriars because of the weight limitation on a dinky bridge up near the top of Snow Hill bank.
Further thought - they would not have been very happy on the wagon turntables, even a Starver did a fair shimmy over them.

G'Day Gents

Hey, Lead_plug did you ever work on the Northern Heights?? I know the N2's J3's and K2's worked up the Edgware branch, I'm just trying to find out what else worked up there such as K3's, B1's, J6's etc and what diesels??
manna

No, manna, the Northern Heights trains were a Top Shed responsibility.

Only diesels I remember occasionally seeing on the Goods (while it lasted) while travelling the other way on 1938 stock between High Barnet and E.Finchley, were the BTH 'Paxman's (allocated TOPS Class, 18).

G'Day Gents
Thanks for that, it seems the Edgware GN station closed such along time ago, that now there's a real shortage of imformation about the branch,oh well, I'll keep trying
manna

manna wrote:G'Day Gents
Thanks for that, it seems the Edgware GN station closed such along time ago, that now there's a real shortage of imformation about the branch,oh well, I'll keep trying
manna

Although passenger traffic ceased to Edgware GN so long ago (1940/41?), it did remain open for freight for a while (can't recall how long). I never travelled between Finchley Central (GN- F. Church End) and Mill Hill E., so made no mention of seeing anything go that way.