The LNER Encyclopedia

What would be the correct Headcode for an A4 Locomotive running with just it's support coach behind?

They don't use headcodes anymore, and back in the day when they did, locomotives didn't have 'support coaches.' The locomotive in the illustration is sporting Express Passenger headcodes, so this would be incorrect, in my opinion. I don't know what the headcode is for empty stock, but whatever it is, that would be the headcode they would have used in the days of steam traction, I would imagine

Thanks for that, which illustration are you referring to? "The locomotive in the illustration..."

If I may expand on my question: I am referring to a situation when say A4 Sir Nigel Gresley is on the main line system and is transiting with just it's support coach. I am assuming that Lamps shown at the front would show the correct headcode?

I'm not completely familiar with modern Rules, but I believe the stipulation amounts to a single high intensity lamp over one buffer. The lamp changes sides after dark. Perhaps someone involved with the Big Railway today can confirm or correct that?

Given that the majority of signallers these days can't see physical trains, headlamp codes are irrelevant and train reporting numbers haven't been carried since the 1970s. There may be rules about where oil lamps can be placed, but I'd suspect they can pretty well do what they like now that they have no significance.

"...but I'd suspect they can pretty well do what they like now that they have no significance."

That seems to be a reasonable assumption, unless anyone else knows differently?

This has come about as I am modelling SNG along with it's support coach in 00 and wondering where to fit the front lamps.

I took a picture of Bittern traveling through Welwyn North with its support coach April 2013, as Jonathan says the loco had a single high intensity light mounted over the near side, drivers side buffer.
The image is on Flickr ... It was working 5Z27 as 4464

Steve

AFAIK there's been no requirement for frontal displays to indicate train identities for many a year, probably coincident with when diesel loco 4-character 'headcode' blind displays started to be set to 0000 or were plated over with two white marker lights incorporated.
Remember that, although the present 4-character 'headcode'/reporting number/train ID system was first introduced in the early 1960s [believe I recall a photo in an Ian Allan Trains Annual of about 1961 or 1963/4 showing a 'Derby'-style DMU (at St.Pancras?) with its 'headcode' panel showing something like 2B74], the traditional lamp headcodes survived well on into the diesel era ; remember that many earlier diesel locos were equipped with the requisite folding white discs and white lights to show them and some (that weren't subject to early scrapping) ran unmodified for many more years.
Although no longer train-displayed, the 4-character system remains, used in working timetables, weekly train notices, signal boxes, Control Offices, online train info. services such as 'Realtimetrains', etc.

Now, I expect the only requirement for frontal train displays is whatever combination of white marker lights/bright headlight that the individual traction type/Class is capable of showing, for such as track worker staff to have adequate visual sighting of its approach, with a steam loco, if only needing to have a modern, standards-compliant headlight when running, being perhaps optionally supplemented only by other frontal lamps perhaps positioned at the discretion of the owner/driver, who, with knowledge of the reporting number allocated for a specific run (like the aforementioned 5Z27 for a support coach transit journey, or e.g. say 1Z19 for a passenger run, or 0Z19 when running as a light engine) might position the other lamps to accord with the headcode which used to apply for the relevant Class of train (5, 1, 0, etc.).

The 4 character headcode boxes on the Brush class 31s were easy to work there was an selecting/adjusting handle at one end of the headcode box and another handle at the other end of the box that was wound around until the correct number of letter appeared in front of you then you stopped winding the handle, the Brush class 47s were a little bit tricky to set up but not to hard though and was also done from inside the cab but if you had to go into 'the nose' of a Deltic to set up the headcode that was a fairly unpleasant experience to have to do wot with the ruddy noise going on as well. When i did my little spell as a secondman at Kings Cross 1974/75 it was still a requirement to know the 'headcode discs' on the front of some EE type 4s that were still 'knocking around' back then it was just pre-TOPS and the abolition of the 4 character headcodes.

The funny thing that makes me laugh nowadays is the front headlights on some of our DMUs working over the Gospel Oak to Barking line there front headlights are so bright i really have to turn away at night in particular from looking at them because they 'hurt my eyes' and also some of the class 66s have 'very powerful headlights' as well that are blinding to look at back in the day the 1960s & 1970s as long as a train 'showed a light' at the front that was enough.

I did read about 3-4 years ago of a number of driver's complaints in CIRAS that on passing other locos or trains while in traffic some of these 'on coming' headlights are so powerful these days that the driver's who made the complaints stated that they had suffered a 'temporary loss of vision' while driving (lasting only a few seconds) and they wanted it looked into and something done about it but i never heard anymore and the headlights still seem as powerful (to me).


Mickey

FINSBURY PARK 5 wrote:...
I did read about 3-4 years ago of a number of driver's complaints in CIRAS that on passing other locos or trains while in traffic some of these 'on coming' headlights are so powerful these days that the driver's who made the complaints stated that they had suffered a 'temporary loss of vision' while driving (lasting only a few seconds) and they wanted it looked into and something done about it but i never heard anymore and the headlights still seem as powerful (to me).

Standardised polarisation offers an obvious and simple solution in the rail environment. Make all the headlights vertically polarised, all windscreens horizontally polarised, automatic reduction in intensity. Much more sophisticated methods are now potentially available, but KISS as always.

.... I should also have mentioned that, these days, with no lineside temporary speed restriction signs being internally or locally illuminated (there are a very few illuminated indicators in tunnels for permanent speed restrictions, including those in Gasworks and Copenhagen Tunnels), an additional necessity for the present day bright headlight at the front of all trains is for the purpose of night-time/poor visibility illumination to the driver of all the retro-reflective lineside signs [permanent speeds, the three or four signs for temporary speed restrictions, 'W' ('whistle' = sound horn or whistle), etc. ]

I don't know wot light bulbs B.R. use to use in the front lights of there Cravens units but at a guess i'd say they were just 60Watt bulbs possibly the same as wot was used in the headcode box on a Brush type 2 as well?.

Yeah good point Stevie about the 'refective' lineside signs i forgot about them.


Mickey