BR Passenger Livery - ex-LNER Locos

[todwriter]

I also wonder about 73040. This was not a WR loco and, again, photos on line seem to show it in black. The RCTS locomotive histories were always highly regarded for their accuracy and I wonder if their standards have slipped recently.

[Blink Bonny]

Ay up!

The list I quoted was taken straight from the Green Book.

[todwriter]

Part 5 of the RCTS “A Detailed History of BR Standard Steam Locomotives”, which contains additional information and errata, states that “it seems unlikely that the engine (73098) ever carried lined green.”

There is the odd case of 73014, sent to Eastleigh in 1964 in black livery from Willesden shed, emerging in lined green and returned to Bletchley. This loco had not been Western Region-allocated since 1960. Sixsmith/Derry show two photos of this loco in green, with comments about Eastleigh maybe running out of black paint (unlikely!) or even assuming that green livery was correct for the class, even though they did not apply it to the Southern’s own batches 73080 - 9 and 73110 - 9.

That leaves 73040 unresolved. Two photos appear in the book by Sixsmith and Derry, one from 1968 the other undated, and the loco is clearly in lined black. It was never a WR loco.

[watcheronthebridge]

There is the odd case of 73014, sent to Eastleigh in 1964 in black livery from Willesden shed, emerging in lined green and returned to Bletchley.

Maybe not so odd. The Railway Magazine loco notes for 1964 have no references to 73014 but there is an entry for 73094. This loco was withdrawn at the end of February 1964, which at the time would normally have meant an imminent trip to the breakers yard. For some reason this did not happen, 73094 was overhauled and repainted green at Eastleigh works and is recorded as being reinstated to Shrewsbury in May 1964. As 73014 was reallocated to Bletchley on 7 March 1964 the two were unlikely to have been in the works at the same time but could there have been confusion between 14 and 94?

Edit: The other explanation for the painting of 73014 in green livery could be that a replacement tender was needed, and only a green one was to hand or a green one was in the best condition. So paint the locomotive green to match the tender. This is plausible - the green painted 73027 is listed as being withdrawn at Swindon in February 1964 and scrapped at Eastleigh in April 1964 - which could fit.

Incidentally the loco notes of 1964 did throw out one interesting incident. This was the case of Eastern Region B1 no 61313 that had appeared at Eastbourne shed on the Sussex coast in June 1964, believed to be the first (and before the end of BR steam last?) Eastern Region locomotive ever to be seen there. According to the Southern Email Group (SEMG) "...Towards the end of June 1964 B1 class 4-6-0 Nº61313 (from 41D Canklow) worked a pigeon special to Lewes. It was stopped with a hot box and spent some days at Eastbourne shed before being sent to Redhill for repairs on 6th July. It spent some weeks at the rear of Redhill shed. Following repairs it was re-steamed at the end of September 1964 and worked passenger trains to and from Reading on 1st and 2nd October 1964. The following day Nº61313 worked a special freight, a long train of condemned wagons (mainly 4-wheel vans) from Earlswood to Streatham Common and from there it returned light to Cricklewood on the first stage of its belated return to its home depot...".

[earlswood nob]

G'day all
There is a photo dated 26 July 1964 in Middleton Press's "Redhill to Ashford" book, showing 61313 at Redhill Shed with its 75B shedplate. When it was repaired the locals wanted to keep it at Redhill, but no luck. A friend of mine got in trouble with his parents for spotting it and going for a trip behind it, instead of going straight home from school.
Earlswood Nob

[Andy W]

The reason why 73094 survived WR withdrawal was that the LMR were at that time hoovering up surplus Standard engines from other regions. They re-instated 73050/94 and 92223 from the WR and 76095/9, 80044/8/50, 80125/9 from the ScR. 73006 was transfered from ScR into LMR book stock as well.

I strongly suspect this policy came to a rapid end after the BRB imposed monetary limits on steam locomotive repairs that year. Some ER 9F were due to go to the LMR as well but were condemned instead and all but one of the Scottish 4MT tanks had a very short LMR career as overhauls were not authorised. In the case of 80129 that was a bit of a shame as it only had a General in March 1962.

I have always put the fact that 73014 went Green down to an error by Eastleigh, who were only just starting to deal with "unfamiliar" locos at this time and may have thought it was a WR one.

That B1 must have been the most photographed loco at Redhill in 1964!

[watcheronthebridge]

I have always put the fact that 73014 went Green down to an error by Eastleigh, who were only just starting to deal with "unfamiliar" locos at this time and may have thought it was a WR one.

As my edit above suggests it seems more likely to me that there was a tender swap between the withdrawn 73027 and 73014. The time scale looks right and 73027 was one of only two of this class of locomotive scrapped at Eastleigh works. Both 73027 and 73014 were from the batch fitted with the BR1 tender, so the only issue would have been the colour of the tender. I assume the cost of repainting the locomotive in green rather than black was little or nothing - so avoiding the expense of a tender repair could have made sense.

[Andy W]

Good point - I can see them doing that. I will have to look up my tender change info. when I can get to it.

p.s. I forgot to add 80056 to the list of ScR to LMR re-instatements.

[watcheronthebridge]

After nearly 50 years it may be difficult to prove either way, but it remains a possibility. There is a photograph of 73027 on the net, it is at Swindon works and the tender is missing. But the date of the photograph is wrong, it was taken during a visit in March 1962 so no connection with the events of 1964. Contemporary sources suggest this loco had been around the works since November 1961. Was it possible that substantial work was being done on the tender, if so this could add some credence to the tender swap idea.

[Andy W]

Nice photo. 73027 swapped tenders with 73001 in November 1957 and had tender 795 up until withdrawal in 1964. I have 73027 being c/u at Swindon on 18/4/64 (Swindon c/u dates on the history sheets tend to be period end ones) and then tender 795 reappears behind 73021 at Swindon on 5/5/64.

73021 had until this time tender 815 and I don't have a record of being used again on a WR engine. 73021 was in works for a LC, having had a LI at Derby the previous June.

So back to the drawing board for the reason 73014 went Green, I'm afraid. I think on my next visit to Kew I need to pull the Eastleigh works record sheets for 1964.